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Anyone know where the best place to get tank rock nowadays might be?? Doesn't have to be live I just want decent shapes I can use David G's method on. I know you can get stuff at reefer rocks but I was curious if there is anywhere else I should be checking out. Possibly foster and smith prices or cheaper....

Troy
 

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I'm totatlly sold on the reefer rocks and personally I'm not really even considered to look elsewhere. As long as you already have some good rock to seed with, I don't think you can do wrong with this stuff and the potential of getting some nuissance stuff added to your system with any.
 

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:rotflmao: Yeah they have worked well for me before might as well stick with a good thing! Probably hard to beat their prices too.

Thanks for your input David
 

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Is this a good place for debating base rock use? If no, then reeferrocks is the best of the base rock bunch.

But IMO I would rather use ocean rock or even make your own. If your going to use ocean rock JNS is just over cost and darn close to Roseville.

If you would like to discuss LMK :) I don't want to side track if your already decided.
 

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I got some Fiji from F&S and I wasn't terribly impressed with it. A couple good peices and broken stuff.

I also received some Carribean Rock from Jerry (uncured) and that was good.
 

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HFG said:
But IMO I would rather use ocean rock or even make your own.
With LR regardless from a person tearing down their tank or from a aquaculture type facility, there is always risk introducing LR. Providing you have mature LR to seed with it is less risky to seed your own. I honestly don't really care how much if any of a cost savings there would be if any.

Bill Bramucci was the perfect testimony to me why not to buy LR providing you already have some established rock that you can seed reeferrocks from. He got some incredibly nasty algae ( I don't remember the exact name or spelling but something like Dipdiota and I want to think it was from the TampaBay cultured LR ). Stuff grew like mad once it took hold and next to impossible to totally erradicate it. At first it was a nice purple looking stuff but was a total nightmare to get rid of and quite destructive to corals.
 

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David Grigor said:
Bill Bramucci was the perfect testimony to me why not to buy LR providing you already have some established rock that you can seed reeferrocks from. He got some incredibly nasty algae ( I don't remember the exact name or spelling but something like Dipdiota and I want to think it was from the TampaBay cultured LR ). Stuff grew like mad once it took hold and next to impossible to totally erradicate it. At first it was a nice purple looking stuff but was a total nightmare to get rid of and quite destructive to corals.

I got the TBS rock and got just about every nasty you could think of including parasitic isopods, 20+ gorilla crabs, tons of mantis shrimp .... BUT TBS rock is unique in that they take it out the ocean , move it to a holding tank where it sits for a day or two and then is shipped in water via airport to airport in just a few hours. Basically everything lives, i even had some type of underwater centipedes ... I have to say getting the rock and seeing all of the stuff in your tank is fascinating and i wouldn't have done it any other way but id never buy that crap again : )

Think my first stop would be Jerry or maybe premium aquatics, the prices there are not too bad and they can do normal ground shipping in two days so it doesn't cost a fortune.

I have to say the guys at PA are really stand up characters. I bought 100 pounds of rubble from them and much of it turned out to be marble sized so he sent me out another hundred pounds and also paid the shipping. I didn't even have to give him any real grief about it, just sent him a pic of what i got and they took care of it right away.
 

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sweet, we get to debate!

First, let me say I thought about getting 1 rock for a 10g of the Florida stuff, just for fun. I have my doubts about how great a filter it is, but watching critters is cool :)

I felt with Reefer Rocks that after years it was still shedding the initial detritus. If you cook that stuff, first it will take a few months to really get cooking (since it has little to no bacteria to start with). Second, it will take a super long time to cure. It is loaded with thousands of years of terrestrial run off (aka dirt aka PO4).

I would rather get some bubble algae rocks and throw them in the yard for a few days then cook them again. (in fact thats how I got my bunna branch filter in my display system :) ). You still have to restart the bacteria, but once it gets going you have years of stuff to clean out, rather than thousands of years of stuff (also gets that nasty Coraline out which limits anaerobic digestion).

Thats how I understand things as of now :)

On a side topic: I talked with E.B. and asked which rocks were best for filtration, had their been any studies on anaerobic capacity of different rocks...ect. It seems that even something as small as a grain of sand can have aerobic and anaerobic zones.

If aesthetics are out, and filtration per dollar is your calculation, it seems rubble is the way to go (without going into the potentials of sand). EB opinion as many types of rock from different areas would be the most beneficial because of species diversification.

Now, you have a tank full of stuff, no chance you will be adding any unknowns, base rock is smart. I might be inclined to buy the cheapest LR and ask for it to specifically be sent ground to avoid shipping or buy up an old tank... or something. As good as RR look, I am still unconvinced it is the best way to go. JME

:)
 

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Sea monkey said:
does reefer rock come in interesting shapes? i have only ordered the rubble from them. I didn't really care what shape it was but most of it was just round Little golf balls.
The big pieces can look cool.. They are honey combed.
They are heavy though. I mean HEAAVY.
 

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Ya I'm sure it weighs about the same as mt TBS rock which is also ridiculously heavy.

well i was looking at the site and this is their "collectors edition"



while having a few pieces in this round shape is cool i don't think i want my whole tank like that.

I was looking at the uncured Fiji at PA and it's only about a buck more a pound if ya buy at least 40 pounds. Because of the weight differences it might actually be about the same price for the same volume of rock. I like your idea of just letting it sit in the sun for a few days if you are scared of getting any nasties.
 

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Fiji looks about the same once you have corals on it, LOL.
I was looking for a picture of my stuff, but that is a fair representation. I got mine a way back, and one thing was their service was great. I got just the color and sizes I asked for.... though "I got what I asked for". I wanted a big center piece. well one rock took up most of the box. I remember it was just a bit large to fit in the 75 g on its "flatter" side. So, probably 45LB for one 16-20" inch ovalish piece.
 

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HFG said:
sweet, we get to debate!
I'm amazed that someone would actually ask for permission. :clown:

I think if you can find rock from someone who's taking down their tank and buy it for a relatively cheap price, is probably the best way.

For the other peoples using reeferrocks, have you found that it sheds a bunch as well? I'm probably going to be buying some new rock soon, it would be nice to know.
 

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HFG said:
EB opinion as many types of rock from different areas would be the most beneficial because of species diversification.
That's odd, since this sort of thing is completely against what is acceptable in the natural world. I don't think the rock in the Caribbean is ailing at all from its lack of Micronesian infauna - and vice versa. ;)

I wonder if anyone's ever stopped to think that perhaps some of this regional mixing of even something like live rock might cause problems to organisms that aren't endemic to that region. Something to think about.

Why would I use Caribbean rock for animals that hail primarily from the Indo-Pacific? :confused: I don't see what would be gained....for argument's sake. :D
 

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Makes sense to me, especially if you are reseading over time.
If I look at my tank. the brains most deffinatly like the spots with a bit of shade and indirect flow... next to a rock often works, the sps like.... yada yada.
I would assume on a microscopic level you get the same thing, and different types of this and that will yeald better results from these and those. Sure, in the end somethings will become dominate over others. But, your system isnt the Carabian or the island of Hawaii... so you don't know which will survive better or be more bennifitial at digesting the specific poisions you add to your system. So yiour adding a diversification of micro regions and a greater variety of organizms from the get go (the former more importiant than the latter). In the end is it a big deal, IMO, no. I don't feel his statment has been debunked, however.


Certianly if your doing a full on biotope that is a specific project that would simply be uncool to mix regional species and decoration. But, this is outside the average mixed species reef tank. Most of us have ricordia side by side our bali aquaculture.

I have no way of studing the true outcome of substrait diversification (though I know the goal is a more stable environment). I don't really know EB reasoning behind his statement. I was more focused on the porasity and anaerobic volume per different kind of rocks. But, I thought I would share the statement since he offered it durring our conversations. :)
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I personally just want to add the best filteration possible to my systems. I think making LR dead then cooking or just leaving it in a no light zone is worth considering over RR, RB, HR...and all the other quarried stuff(stuffed full of nastys or solid as a rock). What we really fear is algae, right?

This is only considering the factor of filteration and cost time and renuable reasources, not aesthetics.

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I've got about 6 Rrocks in my tank now ( added 1-2 rocks at a time several weeks apart ). I submersed in FW with lots of powehead flow and rinsed them one by one every few days and drained the water and replaced with fresh for about 3 weeks in my laundry sink then allowed to totally dry out again before using. There wasn't any loose sediment when I was done. They seeded really quick for me with established rock, within 2 weeks there were already coraline dots all of it. Within three months totally indistquishable as far as coraline from other rock. I personally think the rocks have good shape and do very well in the aquascaping rod method I like to do. I like to use a turkey baster and blow the rock every couple of weeks as maintenance and have very little sediment blowing off and no more than my established rock. It's only been since November of adding it the tank so not quite a year yet. I have over 100lbs in my garage still and I personally have no hessitation to use it all and would buy more if I thought I would use it. It's nice to have it on hand and not having to plan ahead to order LR and cure it when I need some. Not all people have the luxary of mature coraline infested LR to seed with but thus far it works for me.
 

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Graham said:
That's odd, since this sort of thing is completely against what is acceptable in the natural world.
Your not a Shimek fan are you? LOL You know the tank isn't the natural world, right?

:lol:
 
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