I love this thread. But my only thing is about the LEDs. Yeah they are awesome for lighting... If you get the right kind. Lego land is running the 50 watt cannons. They also cost 800 dollars. 1 watt to 3watt LEDs are what should be used for main lighting. But there are strips that can confuse people where 12 LEDs only produce 3 watts. All the hype they create can be a bit misleading. That's the only comment I have about the LEDs. I love LEDs on my tank but I love the look my MH more. But once again, awesome thread. Glad it's started.
A note on lighting
Since so many people get confused about lighting, with all the different types, and measurements, I decided to make a generic post for lighting. I will post it here, so we can all see, and share our ideas so we can refine it, and post it wherever on this site it is needed... instead of trying to explain it 10,000 times. Looking forwards to everyone's contribution!
here it is...
----------------------------------------------------------
In reef lighting, people often get PAR, WPG, lumens, and K ratings confused.
WPG, or Watts Per Gallon, does not work. It does not account for the types of bulbs being usedm or the depth of the tank.
The K rating, or degrees Kelvin, is just color that the bulb appears to our eye. The higer the rating, the firther down the spectrum it is. (10,000 K is yellow, while 20,000 K is blue)
Lumens is just the amount of light the bulb putputs according to our eye.
PAR, or Photosynthetically Active Radiation.... is just the measure of the amount of Radiation, or light, capable of producing photosynthesis.. Now it is not the corals themselves that photosynthesize, its the zooxanthellae. Zooxanthellae has a mutualistic relationship with the coral, and lies within the corals tissue. They then photosynethesize, and give the sugars to the coral, and in return, the coral gives the zooxanthellae a safe place to live.
Bulbs and PAR...
there are so many bulbs out there that say they can grow corals. But which ones are truthful?
VHO bulbs. despite all the hype... VHO bulbs are not very good PAR producers, and should only be used as supplemental aesthetic lighting.
PC bulbs. These bulbs, despite all the bashing on them, are useful for growing any coral, until you hit about 25 gallon sizes. 14 biocubes can grow anything. 29's may struggle with SPS, but for the most part, are okay for growing most coral.
T5HO. These are tied with metal halides as far as less than 24" tanks go. beyond that, the PAR level is just too low to grow anything. There are many parts to getting a good T5HO setup.
1. High Output. You cannot just go out to the hardware store and buy a standard T5 setup.
2. INDIVIDUAL reflectors. without good INDIVIDUAL reflectors, highly polished, most of the light will be directed sidways, and out of the tank. drastically reducing the bulb's eficiency, and goral growth. This one of the reasons why I never will order from odyssea. they are just not up to par (pun intended).
3. ballasts. this is a key in both T5HO and halides. without good ballasts, you will strain your bulbs, and shorten life.. reason #2 never to order from odyssea. Before their redesign, they had problems with their ballasts melting and catching fire. Not good.
4. the right bulbs are the KEY. ATI bulbs are the highest PAR producing bulbs, to my knowledge
All of these combined will give you a very nice setup. As well as # of bulbs, but that depends on size of tank..
Metal Halides.
these babies are the probably the oldest runner in this battle. they come in a 2 tie with T5HO. while T5HO may be good for less than 24" tanks, MH can go much further than that with substantial PAR values. At a price.
The sheer wattage levels used to run HM are crazy. While you may get great PAR at the bottom depths of your tank, you will have to run at a minimum of 250 watts, probably 400 PER BULB. Plus they are very high heat producers. But with the right reflectors, and ballasts, you can cover you tank in few bulbs than you could before. But since this technology is very old, we need a new runner for versatile, high performance PAR producing bulb.. this is where LEDs come in.
LEDs rank #1. This is not just from a blown out of proportion hype about them. this is the real deal. LEDs by far produce the most PAR per watt or any bulb, and produce the less heat, and take up the less space. I just completed an experiment on my 15 1 watt LEDs on my tank. The coral grew 4 times as much, and 2 times as fast as with just T5HO. Now the price on LEDs may be high, but with DIY sites such as rapidled.com, are cutting the startup cost in half. there are also some great fixtures from ecoxotic.com and the aqua illuminations SOL LEDs.They also penetrate the furthest. just see the transformation at the Lego land aquarium!
This is just an explanation on all the types of commonly used reef lighting.. please ask questions if i confused you, or if I need to go more in depth!!
-------------------------------------------------------------------
:blob:
here it is...
----------------------------------------------------------
In reef lighting, people often get PAR, WPG, lumens, and K ratings confused.
WPG, or Watts Per Gallon, does not work. It does not account for the types of bulbs being usedm or the depth of the tank.
The K rating, or degrees Kelvin, is just color that the bulb appears to our eye. The higer the rating, the firther down the spectrum it is. (10,000 K is yellow, while 20,000 K is blue)
Lumens is just the amount of light the bulb putputs according to our eye.
PAR, or Photosynthetically Active Radiation.... is just the measure of the amount of Radiation, or light, capable of producing photosynthesis.. Now it is not the corals themselves that photosynthesize, its the zooxanthellae. Zooxanthellae has a mutualistic relationship with the coral, and lies within the corals tissue. They then photosynethesize, and give the sugars to the coral, and in return, the coral gives the zooxanthellae a safe place to live.
Bulbs and PAR...
there are so many bulbs out there that say they can grow corals. But which ones are truthful?
VHO bulbs. despite all the hype... VHO bulbs are not very good PAR producers, and should only be used as supplemental aesthetic lighting.
PC bulbs. These bulbs, despite all the bashing on them, are useful for growing any coral, until you hit about 25 gallon sizes. 14 biocubes can grow anything. 29's may struggle with SPS, but for the most part, are okay for growing most coral.
T5HO. These are tied with metal halides as far as less than 24" tanks go. beyond that, the PAR level is just too low to grow anything. There are many parts to getting a good T5HO setup.
1. High Output. You cannot just go out to the hardware store and buy a standard T5 setup.
2. INDIVIDUAL reflectors. without good INDIVIDUAL reflectors, highly polished, most of the light will be directed sidways, and out of the tank. drastically reducing the bulb's eficiency, and goral growth. This one of the reasons why I never will order from odyssea. they are just not up to par (pun intended).
3. ballasts. this is a key in both T5HO and halides. without good ballasts, you will strain your bulbs, and shorten life.. reason #2 never to order from odyssea. Before their redesign, they had problems with their ballasts melting and catching fire. Not good.
4. the right bulbs are the KEY. ATI bulbs are the highest PAR producing bulbs, to my knowledge
All of these combined will give you a very nice setup. As well as # of bulbs, but that depends on size of tank..
Metal Halides.
these babies are the probably the oldest runner in this battle. they come in a 2 tie with T5HO. while T5HO may be good for less than 24" tanks, MH can go much further than that with substantial PAR values. At a price.
The sheer wattage levels used to run HM are crazy. While you may get great PAR at the bottom depths of your tank, you will have to run at a minimum of 250 watts, probably 400 PER BULB. Plus they are very high heat producers. But with the right reflectors, and ballasts, you can cover you tank in few bulbs than you could before. But since this technology is very old, we need a new runner for versatile, high performance PAR producing bulb.. this is where LEDs come in.
LEDs rank #1. This is not just from a blown out of proportion hype about them. this is the real deal. LEDs by far produce the most PAR per watt or any bulb, and produce the less heat, and take up the less space. I just completed an experiment on my 15 1 watt LEDs on my tank. The coral grew 4 times as much, and 2 times as fast as with just T5HO. Now the price on LEDs may be high, but with DIY sites such as rapidled.com, are cutting the startup cost in half. there are also some great fixtures from ecoxotic.com and the aqua illuminations SOL LEDs.They also penetrate the furthest. just see the transformation at the Lego land aquarium!
This is just an explanation on all the types of commonly used reef lighting.. please ask questions if i confused you, or if I need to go more in depth!!
-------------------------------------------------------------------
:blob:
1 - 20 of 80 Posts
sum got sum pics of the lego tank?
here is the video
wow they look great in there
so are legos reef safe?
so are legos reef safe?
Legos are inert (so I have read) so they should be okwow they look great in there
so are legos reef safe?
but are they reef safe? i mean they hunt like sharks and stuff will they attack my coral?
Why waste legos in a home aquarium (btw, vintage Legos are one of my other expensive hobbies)? Oh well
If I remember correctly, the AquaIllumination LED pendent produced this reading after about 5 months of use.
Pendent was 16" off the surface with all three LED types at 100%
Just under surface (about 1"): 985PPDF
12" 675PPDF
18" 490PPDF
The tank was not very clean (clear) but I was impressed. It was just a little behind the 250w MH also tested (about 50PPDF higher) and it out performed a 10x80w ATI T5 fixture.
If I remember correctly, the AquaIllumination LED pendent produced this reading after about 5 months of use.
Pendent was 16" off the surface with all three LED types at 100%
Just under surface (about 1"): 985PPDF
12" 675PPDF
18" 490PPDF
The tank was not very clean (clear) but I was impressed. It was just a little behind the 250w MH also tested (about 50PPDF higher) and it out performed a 10x80w ATI T5 fixture.
A word to the wise. Be careful with LED lighting. The PAR is so good that if you arnt careful and dont light acclimate your corals, they will bleach from their intensity.
The reason I say this is my LFS runs LED pendants on their DTs and they are bleaching corals that require high lighting. The light have since been turned down and the corals are recovering.
The reason I say this is my LFS runs LED pendants on their DTs and they are bleaching corals that require high lighting. The light have since been turned down and the corals are recovering.
I just got my led's in i seriously cant wait to see the results. I am installing 30 led's 18 royal blue cree XP-E and 12 Cool white Cree XP-G R5. These will be on three drivers. I did not get the dimmable because i want to use an aqua controller with them. The only thing i cant do is dim them but i can ramp them up in this order. 12 on for 4 days, 18 on for 4 days, 24 on for 4 days, and then full blast 30 on. Would this be to fast?
My tank will have two rows of the 40 degree optics, 12 white and 12 blue, then 6 more royal blue on seperate driver. These will be place towards the front of the tank(in the front part of the bow) and aimed back at the face of most of my rocks. these 6 have 55 degree optics.
I will be getting started in the next couple days.
My tank will have two rows of the 40 degree optics, 12 white and 12 blue, then 6 more royal blue on seperate driver. These will be place towards the front of the tank(in the front part of the bow) and aimed back at the face of most of my rocks. these 6 have 55 degree optics.
I will be getting started in the next couple days.
alright. this isn't getting the attention it deserves. I had a great discussion in another forum here...
http://www.salt-city.org/showthread.php?22297-A-note-on-lighting
lets get this one going as well!
http://www.salt-city.org/showthread.php?22297-A-note-on-lighting
lets get this one going as well!
Read the whole thread. There's a lot of info in there. Im gonna learn more about plasma arch. That sounds interesting.
All I can say it LEDs don't seem like the best thing unless you really know what you are doing....
http://www.thereeftank.com/forums/f76/diy-dimmable-led-fixture-from-scratch-151097-10.html
they also seem to have a narrow spectrum, and some corals do better with the bit extra.
so I'll be running MH lights, and go from there
http://www.thereeftank.com/forums/f76/diy-dimmable-led-fixture-from-scratch-151097-10.html
they also seem to have a narrow spectrum, and some corals do better with the bit extra.
so I'll be running MH lights, and go from there
Getting more attention than it deserves in my opinion. It's mostly personal opinion, speculation and some incorrect information. If someone is looking for an accurate and unbiased post covering the pros/cons of lighting types, this isn't it.alright. this isn't getting the attention it deserves. I had a great discussion in another forum here...
Well thats why it needs more attention, if you have some more facts, I'm sure he will be more then willing to post them and make any corrections this thread needs!
My current lighting consists of two current 96w dual satellites. I basically have 192 watts of 10k and 192 watts of dual actinic. These are on a 36'x20'x20' deep tank. I have pretty strong lighting all the way down to the sand substrate. I have candycanes, 1 lobo, multiple zoos, green star polyps, and of course my Xenia!.....Current has since discontinued making the pc fixtures for t5 fixtures. While the t5 set-up may provide similar light with less wattage, do we actually get better lighting?
You may think that the lighting looks bright to the eye but a par meter would prove otherwise. PC bulbs lack the penetration in that deep of a tank.My current lighting consists of two current 96w dual satellites. I basically have 192 watts of 10k and 192 watts of dual actinic. These are on a 36'x20'x20' deep tank. I have pretty strong lighting all the way down to the sand substrate. I have candycanes, 1 lobo, multiple zoos, green star polyps, and of course my Xenia!.....Current has since discontinued making the pc fixtures for t5 fixtures. While the t5 set-up may provide similar light with less wattage, do we actually get better lighting?
T5HO with a good individual parabolic reflector will focus more light (par) deeper into the tank. So in simple terms, yes you get better lighting with T5HO provided it has the reflectors.
I wish I had a meter to check things out. I actually have thought of replacing my lighting with a more efficient set-up, but don't know if it is worth it at this time of tight money. With the cost of electricity going up here in Vegas...rates always seem to get increased during summer months for some reason...I have been looking for something more economical. Also don't want to make a change that will affect my current livestock..(cash cow - Xenia).You may think that the lighting looks bright to the eye but a par meter would prove otherwise. PC bulbs lack the penetration in that deep of a tank.
T5HO with a good individual parabolic reflector will focus more light (par) deeper into the tank. So in simple terms, yes you get better lighting with T5HO provided it has the reflectors.
Yeah, a PAR meter is one of the new things that can truly set lights apart. I say the few hundred dollars associated with them are worth it... kinda (it is better to have a friend with one :lol: ) . I was impressed by the PPDF readings of th AquaIlluminations LED but on the same token, the MH were better except for the wattage used. I owned a AI LED and I went back to halides. True, the electrical usage was better, but the look (for me) and the PAR was much better... and with deeper tank (since this was tested on a Solana) the halides would be much better. Also, the spread of the LED was somewhat lacking. (I would need 4 units for my old 120 (4") to get the coverage I could get from 2 halides. I also strongly feel that many LED overate their lifespan and output.
Personally, a tank with solar supplement (get sun from a southern exposure or solar tube) is really the better way to go. The PAR reading from inside a sunlit tank (with the 10x80w T5 fixture) was well over 2000 I believe.
Personally, a tank with solar supplement (get sun from a southern exposure or solar tube) is really the better way to go. The PAR reading from inside a sunlit tank (with the 10x80w T5 fixture) was well over 2000 I believe.
Thank you for that futuredoc! I think il re type the main post some time.
in the mean time, has anyone had any experiences with plasma arc lighting?
in the mean time, has anyone had any experiences with plasma arc lighting?
1 - 20 of 80 Posts
- This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
The Reef Tank
A forum community dedicated to reef aquarium owners and enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about flora, health, behavior, housing, adopting, care, classifieds, and more!
Full Forum Listing
Recommended Communities
