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23K views 25 replies 10 participants last post by  tims 
#1 ·
First and foremost, I would like to say hi, I randomly stumbled across this site when doing research for my marine tank in the near future and these forums look like a collage of collected people of similar interests and information, so I figured it was a good place to start asking questions. :)

I have had some experience with fresh water before, but it was quite a few years back, this will be my first try with a salt-water tank.

I've read a few articles from random sources and what not and have come across 2 important things concerning salt-water tanks:
1. They are expensive.
2. They require meticulous care.

So with the small introduction done I move on to my questions.

1. Could anyone be so kind as to post some links to articles or guides for a novice future salt-water tank owner like me?
2. I ultimately want to have a tank with reefs and fish, is that possible in a Nano reef?
3. How much should the tank roughly cost? Any sort of ball park would be fantastic. (I know this is an investment and as such would require more time and money then another hobby but I feel other hobbies don't stand out as much as a fish tank :p)
4. Can any of you share your photos of your current nano tanks that?

I'm sure I have many more questions but just can't think of any off the top of my head. If anyone would be so kind as to throw in small tidbits of information and advice it would be sincerely appreciated. I plan on taking this tank completely seriously so I want to know as much as possible before I start my tank.

Thanks for reading, I will be looking forward to your replies!
 
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#4 ·
Thank you very much for the link and the pictures! Your fish tank looks so intricate and diverse! Out of curiosity, what is all that stuff on the back wall of your tank? and is that the fish from finding Nemo? :p

To be quite honest a significant amount of the reason why I wanted a salt-water tank was due to the movie :x.

Edit: Figured Nemo was not the proper name for the fish so I looked it up haha. Ocellaris Clownfish*

Edit 2: Is there a glossary available with some of these words defined? What is sump? :eek:
 
#5 ·
To be quite honest a significant amount of the reason why I wanted a salt-water tank was due to the movie :x.
Welcome to TRT. Nemo seems to have caused a big spike in interest in SW tanks. Just know that you can't have all the fish in the movie in the same tank, some just don't get along with one another.
 
#6 ·
You are not alone on Finding Nemo propelling you into the reef hobby.
ALOT of people have started that way.

I applaud that you are researching what is necessary. Too many people just go to the pet store and think they will be reefing by tomorrow.

Kelli, is that Green Star Polyps on the back wall? I was going to ask too. lol
 
#7 ·
I do recall reading somewhere earlier today that the tank the dentist had in the movie (if you are familiar with it) was an amateur tank with random fish thrown together. I also skimmed the surface of fish and other organisms compatibilities, I initially wanted an octopus but that seems a bit too far ahead for me haha. Going to try to go as slowly as possible with as easy fish as possible, I was informed that the Ocellaris Clownfish is good for a novice with salt water tanks as they are very docile and easier to take care of. [ Please correct me if I am wrong ]

I also thought of another question:

5. Is it possible to have a 20-ish gallon tank thats more deep and high then wide? Rather then using a conventional rectangular tank that is.
 
#8 ·
Clowns are great first fish.
They are pretty hardy.
Same family as damsel fish.

Just don't try to get an anemone without doing alot of research.
Anemonies are fairly delicate, require high intense lighting systems, and there are some kinds of anemonies that are not appropriate for clowns.
Not all anemonies are created equal. lol

Yes, there are 20g Tall tanks.

The biggest components I found for saltwater tanks from my college days and now is liverock and livesand. They both give bacteria that are extremely important to helping filter your tank water, a place to live and grow.

About 1lb per gallon is a good starting point. Both for the sand and liverock. You can't really over do those two components.
 
#10 ·
Thanks for the input. What is live rock and live sand? is live rock coral? Do you have any links or sites with information I could read? If not a point in the right direction would be fantastic :).

Also thought of another question :D:

6. Do you guys think starting with a 20 gallon nano reef would be a good idea? I do realize that having just reef's or just fish at first would be more easier to maintain but I'm incredibly big into aesthetics for the tank and like the whole slice of nature idea behind a fish and coral tank.

P.S. Finding Nemo is one of my all time favorite Pixar movies. (Hopefully Wall-E turns out just as good ^^)
 
#11 ·
Thanks for the input. What is live rock and live sand? is live rock coral? Do you have any links or sites with information I could read? If not a point in the right direction would be fantastic :).
Live Rock is typically dead coral skeletons that have been compressed into rocks by nature. So no, live rock isn't really "coral".

Live Sand is a joke though. Use Dry sand, in 6 months it will be "live".

The term "live" refers to the living organisms in it that help keep the tank clean and running.

Also thought of another question :D:

6. Do you guys think starting with a 20 gallon nano reef would be a good idea? I do realize that having just reef's or just fish at first would be more easier to maintain but I'm incredibly big into aesthetics for the tank and like the whole slice of nature idea behind a fish and coral tank.

P.S. Finding Nemo is one of my all time favorite Pixar movies. (Hopefully Wall-E turns out just as good ^^)
Given a choice between a fish tank and a reef tank, I would rather have a fishless reef than a fish tank. Just prefer the looks. Zooanthids, Mushrooms, and Palys (Button polyps) are very beginner friendly, colorful, and easy to take care of.

A 20G tank would be fine to start with. Just keep doing the research, be patient, and make sure you have ALL of the equipment you need before even considering a fish to put in it.
 
#12 ·
I don't quite understand.

If I put dead coral skeletons and "dry" sand in a tank and leave it it will become "live" in 6 months? Would I need to set up a filter system or lighting or anything? I'm guessing "dry" sand is just sand at a fish store right?

Do you have any preference on sand brands or are they all the same?

So in essence before I even decide anything I need to pick out a tank shape/size, filter, lighting system?
 
#13 ·
I don't quite understand.

If I put dead coral skeletons and "dry" sand in a tank and leave it it will become "live" in 6 months? Would I need to set up a filter system or lighting or anything? I'm guessing "dry" sand is just sand at a fish store right?
Yes it will. Well, not just the sand and coral skeletons. I have dead coral skeletons in my 10G tank and that is all that is in it (no other rocks, no sand). It has to have a food source. Then the bacteria will grow on it and in it and then it is "live". The term "live" just refers to having bacteria, algae and inverts living on it. Its kind of a misnomer. It isn't really "rock" either in the sense of having a rock in your yard.

Think of a reef in the ocean. It is covered with corals. When they die, they get grown over the top, and the reef grows. As the reef grows larger and larger, the weight is pushing down on the dead skeletons and compresses it to the point of becoming "rock". There is more to it than that but that is basically the process.

If you want rock, buy base rock. Its a lot cheaper than "live rock". It just isn't colorful nor does it have the bacteria on it that you want on it.

Yes, Dry sand is what you get at your fish store, its just dry. You can't use sand from Walmart or anywhere like that as it is silica based sand (bad for a tank). You want Calcium based sand (good for the tank) and about the only place to find it is to order it online or from your LFS (Local Fish Store).

If you set up your tank using Dry Base Rock and Dry Sand, get it cycled, and then stock it, within 6 months to a year it will be "live" and cost you a lot less money than buying "live" stuff to start with. A lot of people recommend "seeding" the tank with a small amount of sand/rock from an established tank.

Do you have any preference on sand brands or are they all the same?
Caribsea but only because its what stocked in the stores here and no other reason.

So in essence before I even decide anything I need to pick out a tank shape/size, filter, lighting system?
The first step is to decide what you want to keep in the tank. Then decide on a size/shape. And, get the biggest tank you can afford and have room for. The larger the tank, the more forgiving it is for a beginner.
Once you have determined what you want to keep in the tank, and the size of the tank, you can start determining what equipment and light setup you need for it. Different inhabitants require different lighting/filtration.

HTH
 
#19 ·
Thank you all so much for your quick responses, I'm glad I found these forums.

Regarding the "Live" Rock and "Live sand" if I had "dry" sand and "live" rock together would the cycle be faster (visa versa)? or are they independent from each other?

As far as what to keep in the tank goes, I've settled on having fish and rocks together (FOWLR- I think?). I read that certain corals need stronger, higher intensity lights then no coral tanks, and depending on depth I may need an even stronger light. Would the stronger lights effect certain fish? (Like the clown fish for example.)
 
#21 ·
I don't have a link, but if you would like to do some further reading on the hobby you can take a look at Robert Fenner's The Conscientious Marine Aquarist. Should find plenty of used ones on Amazon.com
 
#22 ·
So here's the update:

Thanks everyone for your posts and prompt responses, I'm glad these forums are such a great source of information.

I borrowed a few books from the library for some reading on the train and such, a few more questions came up.

How long would it take before my tank will have some sort of visible life in it? like corals or fish?

How long do I leave a tank with dry sand and "not Live" rocks until they become live?

Do I just leave them there to become live or do I add things to the water?
 
#23 ·
First off, I think it is great that you are taking the time to read up. When I was not at at home mom, I was a librarian...so I am big on books and articles, I'm glad you are making use of the library. You've also inspired me to commit to hitting the local college library this weekend or next to pick up a few articles I've been meaning to nab.

How long do I leave a tank with dry sand and "not Live" rocks until they become live?
Do I just leave them there to become live or do I add things to the water?

You could try using some live rock to seed the dead stuff. I think what I will do when I set up my next tank is, not only allow for the live rock and sand to contribute their own biodiversity, but use GARF grunge to give it a boost. I used it after my tank was a year old and I have a healthy pod and mysis population flitting all over my tank. Good for snacking on some of your algal communities and good food for the fish!
I am sure you will get other ideas on the matter. Just my :2cents:.
 
#24 ·
hey there pookynyc, glad to see you want a nano and not one of those over sized glass wall things.. haha.. anyhoo.. I have a 10g tank.. it has some of what they call "soft" coral.. they are the easy stuff.. I think 20g would be a great tank size to start on.. I personally wouldn't get a 20g tall tank, I have read a good bit on how its hard to get water flow to the bottom of the tank.. I mean, sure you can put one of those power heads in there. but I'd rather not.. anyhoo.. lets see..
Live Rock - I have some.. Its only like 40% of my tank though. I got some really sweet looking "decortive rock" as the called it at the LFS.. its like 6-7 pounds worth.. I only have 4 or so pounds of LR.. but, my tank has been only set up for about 2 months coming up, and I really scored some sweet small pieces of LR.. they were from a very well established tank.. so not only have I not had to buy a single coral yet.. its been very good for my tank..

SO lets see.. if you rather not get live sand (which I would recommed) you can get alittle bit of live sand from someone around your area and mix it with your dry sand.. and wah-la! live sand.. well kind of.. it will take a while for it to really become as rich in little living stuff, but it will happen.. I dont really think you can put a real time frame on it.. 1-2 months.. 3-4.. I dont know.. but I wouldn't say no long.. but it would take a few months..

ok!! to the live rock.. so like I was saying above.. I dont have a tank full of live rock, but only after 1 1/2 months of the tank being set up.. ( have fish, my softies in there now) coralline agae (the purple stuff) is starting to spread around.. coralline algae.. hang on, let me conform what I'm about to explain with wikka.....(5 min later)ok I'm back, so I right, its just a form of Algae, its a form of calcium build up.. but also builds your rock up with bactirias.. so in time, it will have living organiums fill in the pours in the rock to make it living.. not to mention its very pretty, My wife loves the purple.. hehe.. but its also a great anti-algae (the annoying kinds, which you will see no matter what.. its just the name of the game I guess) green algaes and what not cant grown on a surface with coralline algae like on other surfaces. oh.. FYI, after you tank cycles, to have some aglae and it goes away, and you get a green slime.. its very lite though. it almost looks like someone spray paint bright green on your rocks.. give it a day or two, it just might be the start of coralline build up! thats how it did it in my tank, I've heard from the guys at the LFS say that people scrub it off their rock.. and then they ask why they dont have any coralline.. random..

umm ok, yeah.. thats all I got.. I really dont use this site too much, only at work since almost every website in the world is blocked here. I use www.nano-reef.com I have a tank page with my tank on there.. I use the same screen name if you want to look me up if you venture that way.. IMO, I like N-R alot better than TRT.. not that its bad here, I just get very very different opinions that dont seem to match my taste or my some one my own personal reseach. again.. thats just me.. not to mention its all about the small tanks there.. unlike the this very inactive nano page here.. HAHA..(dag on 55+ reefers, save some room in your house for babies and cats and dogs! buy a nano) but eaither way you'll get your answers answered and help if you have any questions..

OH!! yeah, if you like those all in one tanks.. they are great!! just dont get the marineland 12g Eclipse, its a big piece of junk.. HAHAHA.. not very good for reefs.. biocube, aquapods.. good!! oh, and people will say you will have to mod it left and right... I actualy have a friend who has one, and all he did was upgrade the lighting.. so if you head that direction, dont get werry on people say you have to modify the all in ones to make them work for reefs.. they are just much father in the hobby than you or I.. ok.. I'll stop typing now..

... eh.. just one more line for fun.. GOOD LUCK!
 
#25 ·
First off, Nanos are great under the right conditions.
First, you carefully choose your inhabitants to suit your tank. I have many large growing specimens in my tank, but will be moving to a 75gal very shortly.
Second, weekly water changes go a long way to keeping a healthy tank.

Being new to this hobby, I would say that live rock and sand are a must. In a 20 gallon, you should be able to get 10-15 lbs of premium live rock for $70-$80. You may be able to find it cheaper, but I would used premium cured rock so that you have a faster, more efficient cycle. After the tank cycles for several weeks, you will be able to add some other inhabitants. Snails are invaluable. Cerith eat off everything and keep you sand stirred up. Astrea and turbos are good too. I have about 7 or 8 Cerith and 1 turbo in my 24gal. Crabs are debatable. Some swear by them, I personally don't like them. That's up to you.

After the cycle is complete, you could add some soft corals like a toadstool or some kind of leather. Polyp type corals are pretty self sufficient as well(GSP, zoas, palys).
Large Polyp Stony(LPS) corals are good if you don't us Metal Halide Lighting. Closed brains, Torch, and Candy Cane are some good ones to start with. These don't require manual feeding, but will benefit from a little of Rod's foods. The best advice is to ask a lot of questions, and read a lot of books. Currently, I have an Aquapod 24 that is far from stock. Although, in it's stock form, it will support soft corals and some LPS nicely.

good luck and keep researching.
 
#26 ·
As air man pointed out, you wil find opinons everywhere, all are about right, each tank is different adn what works for me, may or may not work for you.

ya gota post a few pics! LOL
but, as far as the sand and Rock, starting off with LIve rock instead of Base rock is good, but you dont have too.the sand and rock will become alive over time. in our type of systems ( nano) that is not very long. You just dont want to ruch in to it.adding extra "things" to the water does not speed things up. usually they make a head acke in few weeks..
once you have the parameters rihgt with in your system, then look to add new life.
please make sure you research each coral or mushroom you place in their! as Kelli has shown, GSP will grow like wild fire. You might want to make a list of what you want and then do the research on it.everyone here and else where will always try to answer the best they can.
I am glad your are reading. that is wonderful. hehe soon you wilhave your own libary!
HTH
 
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