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Old 05-09-2007, 11:00 PM   #1
PHIL GUY
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Pro Needed!!!need Help On Refuge Measurments Please(refuge Project)


i need some pro help please..i need someone good at making a diagram for me with exact measurments that will work for my refuge.. my measurments of the cube are 36x16x16..i have a mad24 thats going into the refuge with a duel acrylic berlin set up attachment..heres 2 pics to help ..thank you sooo much
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Old 05-10-2007, 06:19 AM   #2
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Old 05-10-2007, 06:59 AM   #3
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180G REEF/1-400W MH/4-140w 60 INCH ACTINIC VHO/2-37w 36' 10k t-5's/(1,034 total watts ...60G duel BERLIN BAG SUMP SYSTEM/MAG24/RO-DI SYSTEM/duel tds meter/PINPOINT PH/Euro reef rs- 180 skimmer.
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Old 05-10-2007, 08:29 AM   #4
Bergovoy
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Hello,

I am not good with drawing online, but I will try to describe the best I can.

Can you split the drain lines so that one drain line goes to one end of the sump, and teh other drain line goes to the other side?

If so, you may want to think about this method...

By placing the fuge on one end, you can slow down or adjust the flow rate through the fuge. Some peeps like a very slow flow through the fuge to allow pods and other growing things a chance to grow before being flushed or swept into the pump area.

Then, after you figure out what configuration you want the sump/fuge, (FUGE-RETURN-DRAIN, vs DRAIN-FUGE-RETURN) Then you need to figure out how much water will drain back into the sump if there is a power failure.

There is a couple ways of doing this. The most accurate way is to run the drain line into the sump, and turn off the power and mark a line from before the power went off and where the water line ends up. You can eitehr measure how many gallons by scooping and measuring, or you can use math.

Measure the width x length x height of water, (between marks), then divide by 231 = Gallons of water that will drain back into the sump.

OR, you can estimate how much water will drain back into the sump by measuring from the display tank, the surface of the water at normal height, and to the (inside)top of the return pipe. (The inside of the pipe)

This is the point where air will start to go into the pipe. This could be the bottom of the teeth of the overflow walls or the HOT overflow or whatever you might have, (again, this is an estimate)

And using the same formula as above, lenght x width x the distance from the top of water at normal, vs the top of water at the bottom of the teeth, or the inside top of pipe of the return pipe.

Once you have the quantity of water that will flow back into the sump, you need to use that formula again, the only difference is you now know the number of gallons, but need to find the height

That formula is Height = gallons / ((length x width) / 231)

NOTE: you should reduce all your measurements into inches

After you find the height of the water that will flow back into the sump, mark that height FROM THE TOP OF THE SUMP DOWN.

This is how much room you need to leave in the sump in case of power failure.

NOW, you can figure out how tall the baffles will be by measureing from the bottom of the sump to the new mark. I would round the measurement down as much as you can afford, ( half an inch or more at least, )

Next you have to figure out a couple more things,....

Continued in next message...
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Old 05-10-2007, 08:33 AM   #5
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You have to determine if you will have an automatic top off device or how often you plan on replacing evaporated water. This will determine the size of the RETURN section of the sump.

The next thing you need to figure out is what all you are going to put into the sump, i.e. a skimmer???

If you are putting in a skimmer, you need to know the optimum depth the skimmer needs to sit into the water. (I Have the ASM G4x and they reccomend 8-10 inches) This means you need that much water in the drain area for the skimmer to sit into. (On my sump, I had plenty of room, in fact I had too much room / water, and had to put the skimmer onto tupperware to raise the skimmer UP)

Let me know if you have any questions so far before I go on...

Thanks

Bill

(or you can call me to discuss this in person at 626-358-4840)
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Old 05-10-2007, 10:58 AM   #6
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before we can help we need a bit more info.

why a Mag 24?

what size are your overflows?

is the sump in the basement?

G~
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Old 05-10-2007, 12:25 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff View Post
before we can help we need a bit more info.

why a Mag 24?

what size are your overflows?

is the sump in the basement?

G~
why MAG24?..CAUSE THATS WHATS RUNN'N MY SUMP NOW AS YOU CAN SEE IN THE PICS

OVERFLOWS?.I GUESS YOUR TALKING ABOUT MY OVER FLOWS IN THE CORNERS OF MY TANK..THERES ONE IN EACH CORNER..

EACH CORNER HAS 2 DRILLED HOLES..

EACH SIDE HAS A DRAIN AND AND OUTPUT

MY SUMP IS ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE WALL IN MY WALK IN CLOSET..HERES A PIC HOW I HAVE IT RUNNING
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Old 05-10-2007, 12:31 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergovoy View Post
You have to determine if you will have an automatic top off device or how often you plan on replacing evaporated water. This will determine the size of the RETURN section of the sump.

The next thing you need to figure out is what all you are going to put into the sump, i.e. a skimmer???

If you are putting in a skimmer, you need to know the optimum depth the skimmer needs to sit into the water. (I Have the ASM G4x and they reccomend 8-10 inches) This means you need that much water in the drain area for the skimmer to sit into. (On my sump, I had plenty of room, in fact I had too much room / water, and had to put the skimmer onto tupperware to raise the skimmer UP)

Let me know if you have any questions so far before I go on...

Thanks

Bill

(or you can call me to discuss this in person at 626-358-4840)
ill call you in a few..thanks for your info,ill try and use it..i still need someone to draw me a diagram. .im not to good with text learning,lol..im more of a hands on training kinda guy
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Old 05-10-2007, 03:12 PM   #9
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Phil, I got your message. Take a look at the following website and call me back.


Bill


http://www.melevsreef.com/allmysumps.html



And, Definately, trade or sell the mag 24 for anything else...

It draws a ton of power, heats the water like crazy, and is loud.

I am using a Quiet one 4000 right now.

BUT, I have a closed loop system for my flow...

I would suggest reducing the return pump to something much smaller, and adding some good power heads...

But call me back, I will answer the phone this time...
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Old 05-10-2007, 09:39 PM   #10
PHIL GUY
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thanks for the link ..i see lots of designs.but.....i need measurments for the baffles and were to put them in my set up in the above pics. ...
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Old 05-10-2007, 09:42 PM   #11
PHIL GUY
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p.s..my mag24 is very quiet and is warm.not hot..its in my sump..mybe others have that problem outside the sump


ANYWAY........................ CAN SOMEONE DRAW ME A DIAGRAM
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Old 05-10-2007, 09:42 PM   #12
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i am guessing you have 2 1" drains on the tank. that equals about 1200gph leaving the tank. i would put a Mag 12 or equivalent on the system.

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Old 05-10-2007, 09:48 PM   #13
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yank everything out and put the skimmer and drains on one end and the return pump on the other. that is what i would do and that is what i have. i would not put sand/algae/LR any thing in there.

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Old 05-10-2007, 10:51 PM   #14
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And I agre with the calcs for the mag 24 is too much pump, you will have to choke it to make sure your tank does not overflow, (i.e. the pump will put more in to the tank then what the drains can handle onthe way out of the tank)

And I had the mag 24, and the water temp dropped 4 degrees the day I replaced it. Andif you think the mag 24 is quiet, wait until you try anything else... It will be like a whisper.
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Old 05-10-2007, 11:09 PM   #15
PHIL GUY
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THIS THREAD IS NOT ABOUT MY MAG24..ITS ABOUT MAKING A FUG
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