Pump Advice for Closed Loop/Spraybar

MiddletonMark · 03-09-2004, 07:01 AM

Hi -

I'm setting up a Melev-style `over the back' closed loop on my 58 ... and looking for the pump to do it. As I've had good luck with my Little Giant pump as sump-return ... I'm considering one for this closed loop.

Anyway - I really like one that is labeled as free-flow ... and I'm wondering what folks can teach me about whether this is appropriate for a closed loop - where it will be running to a spraybar, maybe T'ed off to an eventual SCWD if I decide to add that. As it stands now, it would be run over the back then reduced to a 1/2" spraybar along the back and back-bottom of the tank.

Here's the info I read about the two types ... I'm looking at one of the MDQX [#4, at 1350, 1180 @ 4ft head] ...

quote:
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'Quarium Series MDQ models handle back pressure well- Recommended for high head heights or for canister filtration systems
'Quarium Series MDQX models are best suited for free-flow setups, where water encounters very little back pressure

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Do I read this right to mean that the MDQ would be appropriate to my use [back-pressure from reduction to spray bar/etc] ... or would either be fine to run?

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Have any other affordable solutions for such a pump?

I tried a Mag12, but suprisingly it was kinda loud. Unlike my Mag7, it made a hissing noise [even when not hooked into closed loop and running in RO water]. Given it's a little loud, I'd rather not have the heat-transfer of a submersible ... and think that the LG would be just as loud and a better bet for external use IMO.

Have considered other pumps, but all seem a lot more expensive [Iwaki, Blueline] ... or of unknown noise level [Mak4?]. Given my current LG isn't too bad for noise - figured I go this route.

Thanks!

Doug1 · 03-09-2004, 07:54 AM

Hmmmmmm I think for an over the back and spray bar application the pressure rated would prolly be the better bet, then again it might not matter

MiddletonMark · 03-09-2004, 08:42 AM

What would be the difference between the two?

Would I just shorten the life of the pump by giving it more pressure than it wants ... or would it burst into a ball of flaming pump parts?

I can handle the former I think, but the latter would not be good [as reef tanks have taught me that anything bad ALWAYS happens about 5 minutes after I leave for work].

Geoff · 03-09-2004, 10:20 AM

if noise is a concern, then look at the velocity pumps. they are suposedly very quiet. i think yardboy has one and says it is really quiet. as for back pressure, i do not think a spraybar adds that much back pressure. i would still stay with the high flow pumps. the more holes in the spraybar the less back pressure. the water will still take the path of least resistance. this would be one of your other outlets. you want flow not constriction. so the more holes the better in the spraybar. remember crank the flow, and not the velocity.

G~

Rob_Reef_Keeper · 03-09-2004, 11:30 AM

Mark,

I have a closed loop over the top on my 58.

I use a BLueline 40HD 790GPH going to a SCWD then to the front orners of my tank blowing back towards the LR. The flow is very good. Pump is not too loud too.

MiddletonMark · 03-09-2004, 11:43 AM

Thank you to everyone for the advice!

Well, noise isn't that big an issue ... got a Remora Pro in the stand, a LG 3 series as return pump ... plus the fans on the hood ... so it's not like the tank is silent. I just really hate the hissing noise that this Magpump is giving out ... I'll take the standard hum/fan noise of your average external any day.

Guess I was hoping it was more like my Mag7 or something that only vibrates for noise.

But with the sage advice here - I think I'll be going with my first choice, the MDQX4 ... as it's at a good price, does what I need ... and shouldn't wake the neighbors

More advice always happily taken ... I appreciate everything I can learn in this hobby. Too expensive any other way.

yardboy · 03-09-2004, 01:16 PM

Heck, Mid. It's expensive either way you go. I got a GenX on my skimmer and it's so blasted noisy. The Velocity is really quiet, but I think it puts too much heat into teh water (either that, or the noisy GenX does) I've gotten a Iwaki 55 now, haven't hooked it up yet. We know what's wrong with those also ($$$$$)
I've used Mag 7's and they are great and quiet. But like you I discovered that the bigger ones (Mag 18 in my case) is quite a bit noisier. I've got mine installed weird, so I'll try and remount it a different way and see if that helps.
Good luck with your decision.

jeffsreefdotcom · 03-09-2004, 02:18 PM

I have a velocity T3. It's super quiet. Almost like it's not there. It does add heat to the water though.

My tank is in a basement where the ambient temp is about 65 degrees. My tank is always around 78, but my heater is set at 75. I guess the extra heat comes from the pump.

MiddletonMark · 03-09-2004, 02:26 PM

Well, it's good to know the GenX makes a racket ... have been tempted by that one. The Velocity `T' pumps sound great - but the heat I just can't handle.

Tank is in my living room - with south/west facing and a dark outside paint .... meaning in the summer I need to keep the A/C at 79/80 to keep the tank at or below 82 degrees [58g tank with 2 x 175w MH's]. No A/C needed if it gets below about 65 at night or not above about 85 ... but another couple of degrees heat is not desired from a closed loop.

Esp as the skimmer and the return pump aren't perfectly silent - just looking for something that doesn't sound like a P-O'ed snake in my living room all the time. [mag 12 does] Fan hum, I'm cool with that

---- Wow, great responses. Now just wishing it was downstairs so I could try these `T' pumps and make it nearly silent. Next tank, I guess [but that's going to be plumbed into a store-room sump anway]

cyberchef · 03-10-2004, 01:54 AM

Mark check out the Sequence pumps. A 750 series pump should handle your application very well. They are almost as quiet as the ampmasters, have better seals, move a lot of water and are cheaper than the ampmasters. Check out My Reef Creations and A-Z Ponds.

http://www.myreefcreations.com/

http://www.azponds.com/new%20sequence.htm

MiddletonMark · 03-14-2004, 02:23 PM

Thanks to all who helped me with this.

Wished I could go sequence ... but just seeing the added 1000+ gph from what I went with [LG 4MDQX] for the closed loop on my 58g tank is awesome.

Very worthy to have done ... run Melev-style over the back ... returns to a spraybar that extends the length of the tank behind the rockwork, keeping the tank bottom [bare, now] clean. Great water flow without seeming like any jets going ... just suspended detritus

A number of SPS slimed up good once it went on ... some others showed polyp extension [during `day' no less] like I've never seen out of them. We'll see about long-term benefts, but was nice to see them respond in a way I consider positive just within minutes.

Now, to siphon the last of the 1/4" substrate out from in front of the rocks next weekend or so.

But was great to get the help here ... and the additional encouragement to go with a closed loop. Quiet, effective, and none of those darn powerheads. Nevermind the enjoyment of clouds of detritus/debris flying once it got plugged in. Never thought I'd be so happy to see the tank cloudy