will things be ok without a cleaner shrimp?

pastina · 06-06-2006, 03:06 PM

im making my want list for my 55 gallon and when it came down to shrimp i really would like it if i can get away with not getting a cleaner shrimp.
sure they're cool lookin but they always mess with my peppermint shrimp and i hate that. i need peppermint shrimp lol, i just love them and they are so great and cleaning up the left overs
i dont have fish yet and when i do it will prob be a few green chromis and a pygmy angel and maybe a small foxface, anyway would it be ok to skip the cleaner shrimp?? or will parasites run amok

afbengochea · 06-06-2006, 03:13 PM

I dont have a cleaner in mine. I just have a couple of peppermints and some blood shrimp. Oh, and a coral banded shrimp and they all get along. I have had cleaners and peppermints together in the past and they seemed to get along fine.

leveldrummer · 06-06-2006, 03:15 PM

yea you can skip the cleaner, i just have pepps and blood too, the blood shrimp clean fish also.

Hardhead Cat · 06-06-2006, 03:15 PM

I don't have a cleaner shrimp in my 135 or nano but have peppermints, I don't think you really need the cleaner shrimp, although I agree they are too cool. I've not had any problems mixing cleaners and peppermints together, only the other more aggressive types....

HHC

Twitterbait · 06-06-2006, 03:24 PM

you will probably be fine. if you don't have a tang they are not a necessity.

pastina · 06-06-2006, 03:24 PM

the blood shrimp are those firey red ones?? ooo their pretty, and their like 40 bux! lol..but thats ok
yeah it may be because i have one peppermint and one cleaner in a 10g nano that is the problem. i have 15 lbs of live rock, the cleaner beats the heck outta the peppermint
so could be the small tank. and he doesnt even clean my clowns lol
well he tried but gave up since the clowns bit him

nope no tang on my list

Kevin1000 · 06-06-2006, 04:33 PM

Cleaner shrimp are pretty neat critters ... but the common belief that they can eliminate ich or keep your tank parasite free is a myth. If your concerned about ich or other parasites .. then QT your fish.

pastina · 06-06-2006, 04:40 PM

ahh ha so they dont do much for parasites

thanks thats all i needed to hear, i thought i needed them to control parasites and without them my fish would get ich
cool beans, no need for a cleaner then

Twitterbait · 06-06-2006, 05:46 PM

Actually i will respectfully disagree with Kevin, they do rid the fish of parasites... but if you have major problems with them then the cleaner will not be enough. they also put the tangs at ease from my experience. You should be fine without one. but i always recommend the skunk cleaners to anyone who buys a tang. they do a lot of good.

Kevin1000 · 06-06-2006, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twitterbait

Actually i will respectfully disagree with Kevin, they do rid the fish of parasites....

While they may remove some parasites ... the common perception that they are an effective measure against parasites in a closed system is not realistic. The life cycle of parasites within our tanks is such that a cleaner shrimp is not considered an effective method of control.

Further ... while cleaner shrimp are known to jump on fish and therefore many assume their eating "ich" etc ... they jump on your hand just as readily and its pretty clear that you don't have ich.

There have been a number of studies about cleaner shrimp .. to my knowledge no one has found ich within the stomach content of cleaner shrimp in the Ocean --- my recollection is that the primary diet of the commonly collectly/sold cleaner shrimp is gnatid isopods.

leveldrummer · 06-06-2006, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin1000

While they may remove some parasites ... the common perception that they are an effective measure against parasites in a closed system is not realistic. The life cycle of parasites within our tanks is such that a cleaner shrimp is not considered an effective method of control.

Further ... while cleaner shrimp are known to jump on fish and therefore many assume their eating "ich" etc ... they jump on your hand just as readily and its pretty clear that you don't have ich.

There have been a number of studies about cleaner shrimp .. to my knowledge no one has found ich within the stomach content of cleaner shrimp in the Ocean --- my recollection is that the primary diet of the commonly collectly/sold cleaner shrimp is gnatid isopods.

ive also read that instead of eating the ich parasite, the shrimp usually concentrate on the dead and decaying flesh around the area that each parasite is attached. same reason they eat off your hand, they are eating dead skin cells, it will help fish battle the infections and promote faster healing.

pastina · 06-06-2006, 06:48 PM

it makes sense. mine even attacks my glove. he eats alot of stuff off the live rock, what hes eating i have no idea, but i am packed with pods of every race

i was thinking of an alternative, would a neon blue goby be a good choice?
i read they clean fish as well, and at least i dont have to worry about him going after my peppermints

Doug1 · 06-06-2006, 06:53 PM

Cleaner shrimp are interesting and can help promote good health in some fish, but relying on them to control ich or other disease outbreaks is putting a heavy burden on them, one they may not live up too in the long run. Some fish tend to avail themselves of cleaner shrimp and it may put them at ease, but thats no substitute for maintaing good water quality, providing a great diet and maintaining a stress free environment by paying attention to the nutritional and terrritorial needs of the fish in question.
FWIW a small Foxface will grow to be a larger foxface, while they are as a rule hardier than most tangs, they are cousins so to speak and the same rules apply to them as tangs, Hi veggie diet, Selcon supplement, adequate space and lack of aggressors to stress them