what would be perfect for you

[Scodz]

hey guys
I would not even attempt this on another reef board but I was wondering something......?

here is the simple background


I am trying to prove that you can make money farming corals and that harvesting from the wild is practically unneccessary... I have made money by doing service and instalation in years pass but am now trying to give something back to the oceans. yes it is similar to what GARF is doing. I am farming hand made live rock and have some awesome designs...

My question is what are some of the things you have always wanted in your tank that you couldnt have? what would be good sellers? Live rock in the shape of leaping dolphins?

Seriously what would be ideal? I already produce rocks with a hidden powerhead inside, and also refugium rocks that are hollow and have different types of "window" walls including glass and different mesh sizes. I have some other cool cool stuff as well, all specialty items. So I am looking for ideas here, throw me a gem and I will try to send you a piece actualized ( you pay shipping). This really isnt spam or anything, I am not looking to profit off you all

This board is the only group of nice people I have seen where else do people post a whole hearted good morning ?

Anyway any thoughst would be appreciated, anything Live rock related or not what would change the industry??? I'll post some pics and you guys can critique my rock if you want...

[beach bum]

How about an entire tank inside the rock? Like having the stand itself be made of the same rock that ALSO frames the tank AND forms the floor of the tank AND the walls of the tank! Oh, wait a minute, then you couldn't see the fish!

Actually I would be interested in a corner shaped piece, something with a near 90 degree edge to it, connecting two flat sides plus a flat bottom. Something like that, if it could also incorporate a deep cave would be perfect for my beautiful trigger, she's definitely a home body (loves her cave).

OOOOHHHH, how about lava-lamp-in-a-rock?

[beach bum]

Now you got me thinking! When I was last at the Monterey Bay Aquarium they had an eel species tank where the whole back and side walls was a single piece (maybe many attached seamlessly) with tunnels for the eels to go in and out of. But all the viewer can see are the holes they enter and exit, AWESOME. So maybe single piece aquascaping? Might be handy for odd shaped or tall aquariums, 18t, 20t, 70t, and 90t all come to mind because it's hard to stack rock that high.

[eaglelox]

hey scodz, i think it would be cool to have a skull face like in treasure iland that was all live rock. i dont think your ideas are bad, or that they warrent heckling from others and you are right about this being a friendly site.

[discented]

hey whats going on? Well this isnt inventive or anything but i was looking for a nice flat rock and they all seem to be very expensive where i come from....i'm talking maybe 6 inches wide, 18 inches long and an inch thick or even skinnier if it durrable. What do you think?

[GaryG]

When I had my fresh water tank I had the "no fishing" sign, and the bubbling treasure chest with the scuba diver hanging above it. But that was fresh water, or maybe even in a FOWLR tank.

In my opinion once you move up to a reef tank you are trying to recreate a small piece of a real reef. I think it should look as natural as possible. So I would not want to put in anything that looks man made. It's impossible to do 100% but I try to hide as much of my mechanics with rock and coral.

So .... I LOVE the idea of the power head hidden in a rock. I would like to see more things like that. Heaters, and other mechanical items disguised as rock that could be mixed in with real rock. I also like the idea of fake rock building pieces like corners and shelves. When I built my reef wall I spent hours going through the tanks at a few different LFS looking for just the right piece. It was like building a jigsaw puzzle. I would be great to be able to custom order just the right rock.

[FishDaddy]

Scott,
I think what you're attempting is a great idea! Many of our members have made their own rock and it not only saves money, they can make the size rock needed. Not all of us are as handy and it would be a nice resource for those DIY challenged.

The prevailing concept seems to be to have the natural reef look but reef tanks being individual art works, who is to say a custom sculptured piece is wrong? One distinction from freshwater or FO tanks is that reef tank organisms sometimes cover the rock and obscures detail........ Eagleox's skull face might become an amorphous shroom farm, for instance.!

What are you using for the material? How 'bout posting some pics of what you have done?
Dick

[kestrel]

Oh yea, your the man I've been looking for... I've been thinking of trying it myself, but am still a little intimidated by the cost/effort to get started. I can't find Southdown, so the sand would kill my budget.

What I would find useful is a large platform/shelf to go under all of my other rock to lift it out of my sand. That way I could have more sandbed, better water circulation to the bed, more digging room for my pistol/goby pair, and less worry about rock wall stability on the shifting sands. You could even start with a PVC-legs-and-eggcrate shelf frame, then just cover the exposed areas and sculpt it to look more natural. Maybe 6-8 inches wide, 18-20 inches long, ~4 inches tall. Hmmmmm... maybe if I could just find some Southdown...

HTH
Daryl

[Stang69]

I agree with the above post the slab pieces would be nice as the slab pieces are always weigh so much in the lfs and are sometimes way to expensive to ship. Last one I looked at was about 60 lbs and at 6 bucks a lb thats a bunch of money for a rock hehehhe.

Jeff

[MontanaRocknReefer]

Well for me it is the real thing baby all the way! Johnny

[mojoreef]

Hey scodz nice touch. I believe in making rock also, you can come up with neat shapes and designs. I think if you could come up with modular designs ( such as several peices that interconnect to form ridges, flats, caves and so on) would be cool. you could have them connnect with the use of plastic dowels in pre drilled holes. Just ask the customer to design his or her reef by drawing you could put it together using pre made standard modulars. Anyway thats they whay we used to do it.


here a pic of a neat peice

[Scodz]

You know mojoreef al the good info I find on rock making is old "outdated" technology, I hope we swing back to the trend and don't leave it to the aquariums and zoos, its cheaper and more versatile. Thats looks like a great cave you got there! I have always used dowels and cable ties (my personal favorite) to put a reef together, one of the cool thing I have been working on is coral plug holes predilled in primed locations on the rock, then you get the plugs as well when you buy the rock for future use, that way you can leave the plugs in or take em out and have somewhat of a transfrom rock. what was used for your base mix for the pictured rock?

[Scodz]

Thanks for the kind words fish daddy, as far as materials most of what I used is stuff I collect, I use a lot of shells in my stuff making natural hideaways and a realistic look. I love using broken shells it seems to me to be the ultimate in re-using and recycling. I make the long drive occasionally to Sanibel Island one of the best shelling coasts in the world really, there I get big shells and coquina. for my base mix I use Caribsea crushed florida coral, when I cant find it myself, I dont mix in wuch sand at all because that result in a less porous rock, and only adds a bit of strength if cured properly. The only reason I am not posting pics is becuase everything is curing that I have made recently and it is unusually cold for Fl right now and I dont want to go swimming for it but as I make more I will get pics for sure in the next few days. I also use dead Florida rock that I bought awhile back it is amazing stuff, somebody had a huge stockpile of it that was collected illegaly right after the law changes in FL appearently they dumped about 7,000 pounds I would guess in a bay which changed its beach and left em dry do to the high tidal flows, locals say it stunk so bad they couldnt breath. What a waste, but it has lotsa great natural tunnels and razor clam shells, some jewel shells, cluster duster colonies, amazing stuff I have over a thousand pounds easy but now the source is gone as the bay changed again I also use gorgonian skeletons, and oyster clusters, lots of whelk shells sand dollars, whatever I find, I spend about 30 hours aweek making rock or collecting materials. I rarely use crushed oyster shell, but am going to startsoon as I have had good luck with it, I use Portland cement I have used I II and also III and they all work the same the III hardens the quickest, then II and finally I. I use I most often now because it is easy t o get. I do like white cement but its hard to get in small quanitities and expensive. Portland is just fine by me...

[Scodz]

Tank insde a rock now thats my kind of thinking Thats a very cool project man I almost am upset for you mention that one it seems like a very hard sell and a big time consumer, but it would be worth it just to post the pictures here, and hear comments on the inside out tank. Very cool my brain is going! corner shaped piece would be a good seller what dimensions? The lava lamp in a rock I will leave to you
so the eel tank was an inside out tank? basically a hollowed out rock with glass front? very cool, many companies do large tanks with poured cement rock imitation walls, if you have a bass pro shops fishing s tore neardby check it out the often have large tanks in this style, which are usual in the not best shape unfortunatly...
instant reef one piece rocks sound awesoem especially for nanos and micros,

If anybody has special requests for flat or shelf pieces let me know I will build em and send you a picture, if you want it just pay the shipping and whatever you would think is fair. Certainly not $6 a pound maybe some frags or shrooms or zoanthids... the thing is curing takes a while, you can do it in tank if you have a large tank and don't mind the ph increase. no matter what you would have to wait two weeks or so for at least initial curing. I cure in a tannen rich high flow 3000 gallon pond it cures em quicker than in tubs even with water changes and power heads etc. if somebody wants growth on their rock they just gotta be patient and in touch. Just be specific about requests draw a picture if ya want

[Scodz]

hey thanks for the input guys great stuff! I have always had the same problem finding shelf rock tonga shelf is available but expensive and frankly boring. I have set up alot of nice tanks with what I call a floating platform, a raked shelf piece that has pvc legs away from the front so it seems to float on nothing, unless you crouch down to take a look. I always do footprint reefs, and use pvc legs. PVC is an amazing material underwater I find it is always the first to get covered with coralline and critters... Anyone can make PVC legs simply by using a 1" hole drill bit, the same sorta thing they would drill a tank with.... when you drill the hole it leaves the imprint of an O the pvc is then simple to insert. One tanks I did had a custom made plenum which the pvc was drilled into and then seal so I had big ole rocks being supported with one pipe and they seemed to float off the sand, and were very sturdy. The last three tanks I ddi only had one rock on the sand and that was just to hide the powerhead that kept a good flow over the sand constant, the bed really comes to life from this and we are talking 0 nitrates.

I like natural looking reefs, but I think some unnatural refinement deffinetly adds to the end result. I have done alot of gardening and the concept is the same for me "planned chaos" is how I explain it to customers. Reefing is like take some dirty mixing a bunch of wild flowers into it and throwing it around some bigger plants you have already planted. You want to create emphasis for your bigger plants but allow for beautiful surprises to pop up and not be overshadowed, that means surface area and structure. I love all natural tanks but in that scenario the use of cable ties and support rods like mojoreef is saying add to the end result tremendously. I spend a good amount of times on reefs themselves, wether diving snorkelling or flipping (through a book that is) the themes are always the same in all habitats, drastic dramatic and intense. There are no real slopes more like cliffs, no big boulders more like giant honeycombed limestone cactus skeloton type rock structures. recreating this in minature is very difficult since it always seems to be big and dramatic. Even the great barrier reef which has flat areas of acropora and stonies in the shallows has right close by a deep cliff or channel filled with large organisms like sharks. These extreme areas are where we find the diversity of life a reef tank tries to be. sorry about the rambnling here, but not many folks get into aquascaping theory I just want to hear peoples thoughts on it.
As for everbodies ideas

I have tried Topiary rocks before similar to the skull and they are very cool but an aquired taste. The skull is a great idea what size? human size? It does looe s its appearance over time but that is fun to watch and how cool would it be to have a small moray call the skull its home? I have to confess I experiemnted with faces like you would see in Italian gardens, where the hair would be xenia or colt or something and they were cool but didnt always grow right and were hards to sell