Tanks treated with copper

menelaus22 · 04-19-2006, 02:32 PM

I have a 50g bowfront tank available to me for free. I know it's been a fish only tank in the past and in the process had been treated with copper a couple of times.

Can I use this tank?

I'd obviously clean it very well and replace all of the substrate.

whatevva · 04-19-2006, 02:41 PM

The copper can leach into the silicone at the seams.

menelaus22 · 04-19-2006, 06:44 PM

It's a glass tank. I'm not sure if that makes much of a difference. Will a very small amount of copper make a noticeably negative impact?

Does anyone know of a way to test it out before I dump all my livestock in there? Or, does anyone have any suggestions for properly cleaning?

VWD · 04-19-2006, 06:52 PM

I have to say that it is 50 50 on the copper, I have a tank that was treated with copper and have used it sincethen for inverts. no problems, The way I see it alot of people buy used tank without the history evryday and set up reefs. A chance I think. You may be able to get a test kit that will read very low levels.

Loverotties · 04-19-2006, 07:57 PM

Copper gets in the silcone.

VWD · 04-19-2006, 08:35 PM

But will it make a tank a bad tank, I don't think so, I like to take a poll of everyone that over the years got a used tank and had no problem and did not know the history of the tank , I say that most of us have and I have many and I never had a tank kill inverts or one that I could'nt keep them alive. I think It would be few that have the problem then more. just my 2 cent worth.

tdwyatt · 04-20-2006, 09:21 AM

I do not know the "for sure" answer, but in the past bssed on posts and info requests, systems that have had copper (or had undocumented FW histories) in them have occasional unexplained deaths of corals and other inverts in such systems. This is based solely on my recollection of the frequency and I do not have any documentation, nor can I show you any definitive experiments on copper-free systems vs. systems with coper histories to suport this POV. I can't tell you that it is due to the copper, if this is an issue due to something else unrelated to the copper history, or if there is some accumulation of copper over time in inverts in particular; but for the relatively low cost of the tank compared to the cost of coral specimens, I'd just err on the side of caution and get a new system or one that is copper-free for certain if used.

JM2CW

JennM · 04-20-2006, 02:23 PM

You could always fill the tank with water, let it sit a while and then test for copper.

In my experience, this is not a problem - the amount of copper that could be absorbed by the silicone and then leached into the water is trace - and many reef supplements contain trace amounts of copper - it's a vital mineral.

Unless the tank was NUKED with lethal amounts of copper for an extended period of time, I'd say it's safe to use, based on my own experience.

The live rock that came with my 1000 g FOWLR tank had been coppered many times - but over the last couple of years it has "come back" to life. I have many huge pods and other fauna that should have not survived. I also keep two large sea stars in that tank without problems.

I wouldn't suggest or recommend using substrate or rock that had been exposed to copper, but IMO and IME the tank should be fine.

Jenn

Caoineag · 04-20-2006, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JennM

...Unless the tank was NUKED with lethal amounts of copper for an extended period of time, I'd say it's safe to use, based on my own experience.

Jenn

Umm..that is WHY I won't touch a tank that has had copper treatments, most people getting out of keeping fish weren't that great at keeping fish in the first place. A lot of them, at least that I have seen, did nuke their tanks. Now if you trust the source to understand the basics of measuring, then by all means take the tank, it will probably be fine.

But when I went to buy a larger tank off a guy and he sounded like a young partying college kid and he admitted that he didn't know copper could be toxic to reef inhabitants, I ran fast away from that one. He had "used it like a couple of different times, I think, why?"

Some people are scary

mtfatwork · 04-20-2006, 03:34 PM

if you are worried, get some cooprasorb.

JennM · 04-20-2006, 03:34 PM

Well... I've seen local STORES recommend copper in reef tanks

But don't get me started on that

There are many reasons why people get out of the hobby and sell their tanks. Failure is one - but the battle with nuisance algae is usually the biggest cause, believe it or not (I read that in a few places when I was researching for my business plan).

I took a hiatus from the hobby for a few years when my kids were young - no time, no money... but did end up putting up a FW tank because I *needed* some aquatic pets

People move, people split up, peoples' priorities change, people UPGRADE... just to rule out buying a used tank over a "what if" is a bit extreme, IMO.

I've never seen or heard an actual documented case of somebody using a tank that had copper in it in a previous life, cause problems. Re-using the substrate, or rock would be problematic, or at least potentially so, but just the glass box?

If someone can tell me firsthand that this has been an actual issue, I'll be happy to stand corrected... firsthand being that it happened to themselves, not "somebody they know" and that they had actually tested the water after it had been in the tank for some time, and the test detected measurable amounts of copper.

I bought used tanks for my FO system that had copper used in them (I even use copper periodically in my FO sell system) but between uses, after the meds are properly removed, I don't get any readings on a copper test - and this is even with substrate and biological filtration.

Again - not trying to argue or debate - just offering up my own personal (firsthand!) experience.

Jenn

Caoineag · 04-20-2006, 05:22 PM

Not a prob Jenn, my comment was based on the Craig list for Denver. Most of them start with "I was unsuccessful" or " I used a maintenance service". I have always wondered whether previous copper use was a myth or not but I think my main issue is that I am not willing to run the risk when I have seen how some people dose things.

If I knew the person or believed them capable of competent measuring of copper, I might be willing to risk it. But then again, I do have the biased of not wanting a glass tank that someone yanked the wrong way with water in it and so on. Big fan of new tanks since I only have glass ones.

I have added supplements with copper in them and my starfish never complained but I also took chemistry in college and know something about insoluble metals from lab class which made me afraid of copper in the home aquarium in too high of concentrations.

Out of curiousity, is there someone here who could start a poll on copper killing their tank? I think that would go a long way towards answering this question...