TALK ABOUT LUCK!!! (avoided disaster)

wagnutz69 · 02-21-2001, 08:33 PM

I was in the process of "re-arranging" my 125 gallon reef...moving all the rocks reposistioning my powerheads... and all of a sudden I noticed the water had gotten quite still....like the calm before the storm. Then I noticed a slight flicker in my lights in the house. Then I realized...HOLY CRAP MY RIO WAS TOAST!!! I haven't ran for that fast for a long time, hoping to get it unpluggd before causing damage to my tank. And luckily I made it. Then, to top my night off, not an hour after finishing my tank, which looks AWESOME in my eyes (still building as don't have that many corals yet) the Rio on my 58 did the same thing!!!! It hasn't been but a week sinced I asked the question of anybody having problems with them. And these have been up and running for over a year, coincidence....or????? So, and FYI for anybody thinking about aquiring a RIO pump.....maybe better rethink that thought. Also just wanted to say thanks to all those who had given me the idea to replace, just wish I would have gotten to it earlier, could have turned out much much worse!!!!

WAGZ

Minnreefer · 02-21-2001, 08:36 PM

Sounds like you lucked out, was there any damage? I am replacing my RIO and going to keep it as a back up so I don't have to worry about this problem.
Jonathan

wagnutz69 · 02-21-2001, 08:41 PM

Luckily I don't believe there is was any damage done. My angels have ick a lil bit, and so does my dragon wrasse...but I believe that is from re-arranging their home....and might have caused a bit of re-cycling of the tank. The corals haven't looked better...think they get more light/water movement this way. So hopefully avoided everything..nothing leaked into the tank...hopefully didn't get shocked either...couldn't feel anything like electrical current in the tank myself so have to keep close eye on everything for next week or so.

jlreese · 02-21-2001, 09:06 PM

Hi -

I have never seen so many people have problems with one product like the one you mentioned. I too have a Rio pump and it is running my skimmer. After hearing about so many horror stories I will be replacing my pump this weekend!

Maybe I catch it before something happens to mine.

Pik · 02-22-2001, 10:33 AM

Wagz,

I had that same problem last week! Still have one Rio running in my tank for return.... that BETTER NOT go bad!

Pik

mandarin1 · 02-22-2001, 12:27 PM

So if rio pumps are a bad choice what are good replacements I need a replacement for a rio 2500 that runs my skimmer and a 1700 that is in the sump of another tank

thanks
Keith

wagnutz69 · 02-22-2001, 07:39 PM

I love that last statement they put on their box.."We do not assume liability for loss or damage of live stock or personal property". That should have been enough to make me think that it was a piece of crap. That pretty much sums up the fact you are buying some JUNK!!!!

Raszagil · 02-22-2001, 11:01 PM

Rios are pretty scary...I do believe that Horge (or was it Dark Horge...?) that dissected one and found out the product in question was missing a very important component...? I can't find the thread now, but it convinced me to avoid anything that says "Rio" on it.

Sara

jegel · 02-23-2001, 01:56 AM

I've been running a Rio 2100 for the return line in my sump. these stories all seem to sound the same. Has anyone ever researched the problem or brought it up with the company that makes these pumps? It seems strange that this problem is so well known (at least around this board) but nothing is being done about it by its manufacturer.

I still have the box to mine, and there are 2 different companies,

MORE Production
85-1 Shuiyuan Rd.
Taipei, Taiwan

TAAM Inc.
right here in southern CA

Warranties are only good for 180 days, and "We do not assume liability for loss or damage of live stock or personal property"

Looks like I gotta get me a new pump.

tdwyatt · 02-23-2001, 09:27 AM

hey Sara (Raz!!!)

This is a copy and paste of the info from the thread. As I said before, I normally don't comment on equipment, but this product is actually, in my opinion, a dangerous item and I would very strongly suggest to all of you that have Rio pumps to replace whem with Maxijets (the smaller ones) or the Sen 700 or 900 if you have a 2100 or a 2500. I used them for a few years when I first got into the hobby (I didn't know any better then, good thing for these boards now!), and I was lucky. A few years ago there were a series of failures posted on the AOL board that resulted in several system die-offs, and one that resulted in the fire loss of a building/system. As a result of those failures, I took the ones I had (the 2100 and 2500 models) and took them apart. You'd be surprised at what you can sell in the US these days... Please keep in mind that these pumps (unless this has JUST changed) are NOT UL APPROVED. Here is the post in it's entirety. Hope this helps,

Tom

posted 02-17-2001 09:52 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I normally don't comment on the equipment side of posts, but on this particular topic, I have PLENTY to say. I did use rios at one time, for the money, they put out a lot of output, are submersible and definitely cheap, About 2 or 3 years ago, though, there seemed to be a glut of folks over on AOL having burnouts with the 2500 and 1800 model that ended up poisoning the tanks with pcb's. The problem with the pump is not necessarily that they are shoddy, but that they have no thermal protection circuit. The scenario then plays out like this: Rio's use a cheaper fine wire in the windings for the motor (at least, 2 years ago they did, I dissected 3 of the 2500's after they got REALLY hot in my systems) and although it allows them to work well, when the load gets too much or if the insulation starts to degrade due to the heat, the windings are more susceptable to little shorts, which leads to more heat, which leads to more insulation failure, which leads to more shorts; a vicious cycle. In many PH's and submersible pumps, there is a thermal protection circuit that either temporarily cuts off the motor (ie when the load is too heavy for that motor) or completely shuts off the motor and requires a replacement of a "fusible" link. Maxijets are, for sure, thermally protected, as are many "UL" listed pumps. the Rio's are not. Period. This means that as the pump begins to fail, it will get hotter and hotter until either a major shortout occurs; in which much of the plastic casing will melt and the wire will (hopefully) short out to prevent a grounding event in the tank (at 110 v 15 amps in the US in most households) or the breaker or fuse box activates and the breaker trips or the fuses (in older homes) blow. God forbid that one of these systems fails and the current stays on... I have had people post that there has been a fire at the location of the electrical systems for their tanks using Rio pumps (I believe Alice was on-line on AOL when this was posted a few years ago) For this reason alone, and the fact that your tank will have difficulty recovering from the release of the meltdown products of the pump (even a slow release of the isnulation failure products), please make sure that any equipment that you use is thermally protected, and I would suggest that you have your system's electrical circuits isolated (put on a seperate breaker) from the rest of the power systems in your homes. I'd even put the MH's on a seperate system from the pumps, heaters, etc, just in case the lights trip the breaker (then you wouldn't loose your pumps/circulation if the lighting trips the breaker)
Please, the combination of SW and electricity is bad enough as it is, make sure to take the time to protect your critters (and yourself) from any unnecessary risks. Use GFIC outlets for all your devices going to the tanks, and have an electricial check your wiring for load if you are not sure of the capacity of your home's wiring. I'd much rather read that you lost a coral (I can't believe I said that) than hear that you lost a room, your home, or a life to an electrical short...

Oh well, time to get some coffee... ... what do you mean the toaster is smoking???? :-0

------------------
Tom <"{{{{>(
(TDWyatt)
Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something. -Plato

null

mandarin1 · 02-23-2001, 02:48 PM

What kind is the sen 700 or 900 pumps that are good replacements for a 2500 rio. thanks Keith

JJGeisler · 02-23-2001, 06:36 PM

Wow...here I thought I was picking proven equipment and now I'm reading horror stories from people using Rio pumps! I am right in the middle of setting up my first reef tank (long time fresh water guy but new to reef). I thought since the CBK Bak Pac Protein Skimmer used Rio pumps they were probably pretty reliable. I just ordered a 2100 that I was planning on connecting to an Ocean Currents wave maker (on back-order). Now I'm hearing the Rios are bad news.....Is this true about the 2100 or is it just certain models? If the 2100 is bad news...any recommendations as an alternate?

ReefJunkie · 02-23-2001, 06:45 PM

Hi JJ I wouldn't trust any RIO if you can cancel your order that would be great. I 've always heard good things about MaxiJets. I am goin to st art a new thread on rating pumps so hopefully we will get some input on all of the pumps

Pik · 02-23-2001, 06:56 PM

JJ,

I went on the Marine Depot website today and saw that they now have a UL listed Rio pumps... maybe you can try that? I'm not sure though. Sen pumps are very good and very reliable from what I've heard.

As for the Rio that is running the BakPak, try switching that with a MaxiJet... that might work. It's worth a try.