Sponsor Our Community
Go Back   The Reef Tank > Reef Discussion Forums > General Reef Discussion

General Reef Discussion In this forum we discuss issues related to keeping marine and reef aquariums in a friendly flame-free environment.


Registered Members don't see these ads. Register now it's free!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 01-07-2006, 01:10 PM   #1
russbriscoe
Big Fishy
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Cumming, GA
Posts: 529

Sump/Setup Questions


Thanks for all your help from my last post.

I have been reading like a mad man and have a few questions. My wife and I are still thinking about the size tank. She wants a large one and I want a smaller one because of the added coast... I have been reading and I think I can build a lot of the stuff I need, stand, canopy, sump...

Here are my ideas and then I will ask a couple questions. The tank will be on the main level of the house and all the dirty stuff will be in the basement. I will build the sump the same way people build plywood tanks so I can make it the same size as my main tank if I want to. I will also put it on wheels so I can move it if I ever need to.

Here are my questions.

1.) Does the sump need clear sides or can I build it out of plywood. (Pros/Cons)

2.) If my tank needs about the same #LR as it has water do I need more LR for my sump too? If not why?

3.) If I have more water in my sump will that allow me to have a few more fish?
Registered Members don't see these ads. Register now it's free!
russbriscoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2006, 02:23 PM   #2
tdwyatt
senior member
 
tdwyatt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Walnut Grove, SC, USA
Posts: 13,643
Images: 3
Quote:
Originally Posted by russbriscoe
My wife and I are still thinking about the size tank. She wants a large one and I want a smaller one because of the added coast...

...The tank will be on the main level of the house and all the dirty stuff will be in the basement. I will build the sump the same way people build plywood tanks so I can make it the same size as my main tank if I want to. I will also put it on wheels so I can move it if I ever need to.
Although you did not ask directly about this, two issues pop immediately out with this, First off, if you're speaking about small in terms of less than 65 gal, then keep in mind that although your initial costs may be higher, a larger system is (at least for me) easier and cheaper (except for salt) to run, and is much more stable than trying to micromanage a smaller system. In addition, it is much more forgiving of lapses in husbandry than small systems are.

Also, if you want your sump to be mobile, I would suggest using a Rubbermaid feeding trough (100-200 gal) on a trolley specifically indicated/built for this purpose if you want it to be mobile. They are already finished and are structurally sound, the dollies are built specifically to support this kind of weight, and the material is easy to drill for bulkheads, although I would recommend that you make both the drains to this sump and the returns back to the tank with spa-flex PVC pipe. Getting the support for the sump and wheels appropriate for moving this much weight may end up being more than most folks are able to do with a DIY approach with wood. By the time you get the proper grade of marine plywood, apply the fasteners needed to construct the tank of the appropriate strength, finish the surface of the wood, and caulk/fill all the seams; you'd spend more for the materials than you would for the Rubbermaids, especially if you shop the Atlanta market for a used trough in either the Aquarium ads or the livestock ads.

...And then there is the sweat equity issue...

Quote:
Originally Posted by russbriscoe
Here are my questions.

1.) Does the sump need clear sides or can I build it out of plywood. (Pros/Cons)
No, it does not HAVE to be clear, although working in it over time is a bit easier if you can see into it. Keep in mind that solid opaque sides don't need scraping (to remove coralline and any microalgal accumulations), and most of the stuff people have in their sumps is there so it WON'T be seen. If you want easy, make it opaque, and if you want a viewable sump for a refugium, then place a tank above your sump and let it gravity-feed from one of the upstairs overflows, and drain from an in-refugium overflow into the main sump. There will be enough gravity-driven water force to tumble suspended colonies of Gracillaria spp. of microalgae without problem, avoiding the need for an extra pump for this device.

Regardless of what you construct in the basement, you will need a strong pump with a good head pressure to be capable of returning your water from the basement to the main tank. Getting a sequence or a Dolphin that is quiet, and isolating the vibrations from solid surfaces will help keep your treasure trove in the basement from sonically intruding into your living space.

Quote:
Originally Posted by russbriscoe
2.) If my tank needs about the same #LR as it has water do I need more LR for my sump too? If not why?
Base your live rock placement on total system volume, especially if you keep any critters (like urchins and snail, etc.) in the sump/refugium. Although many folks prolly use too much rock, having the spare capacity will help control nutrient issues with the tank, especially during needed bacterial population ramp-ups if you have an unrecoverable critter death in the main tank.

Quote:
Originally Posted by russbriscoe
3.) If I have more water in my sump will that allow me to have a few more fish?
A qualified yes. Although the extrae rock will provide more capacity for deammonification to support a larger fish population density; the more fish you have in a system, the more potential you have for import of nutrients into your system. Everything you have to feed with imported foodstuffs creates more waste, etc., so the issue becomes not "how many fish can the tank support?", but rather (especially for systems that are centered on corals), "Can I successfully export the nutrient load I am importing to my system in response to the number of fishes I desire?"


BTW, now that you've asked us to help, you are now OBLIGATED to supply photos of the progress...



HTH
__________________
Tom <"))))>(
(TDWyatt)
Wise men speak because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something. -Plato
tdwyatt is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2006, 03:28 PM   #3
Geoff
It can be rebuilt.
 
Geoff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Pittsboro, NC
Posts: 19,158
Images: 166
the only thing i would add is being able to keep the sump easy to clean. you will want to be able to siphon detritus out of the sump.

i know, post a pic of the possible placement place of the tank. we will help you decide which windows you will need to board up in order to fit the big tank there.

G~
__________________
Think Tanker
Friends Don't Let Friends Use Refugiums!
Reef Knowledge Impaired
"J" crowd member.
My Build Thread
Geoff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006, 10:08 AM   #4
skeety
Tang Lover
 
skeety's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Rockville, MD
Posts: 7,284
Images: 144
All great advice so far.


I'd just like to add to Tom's comments about expense of a smaller system vs larger system.

The fact that you're more likely to have success with a larger system than with a smaller one (as mentioned...more forgiving and slower changes to water params, because of the increased water volume) I think you'll end up saving a lot on replacement critters (stuff that died, etc).

Also...In MY opinion, there really isn't that much of a diff in cost between a 30 gallon and a 70 gallon tank (random numbers...just an example). Here's why:

I've rarely seen skimmers rated for 30 gallons. Most start out at 75 (even though they are overrated). My point is...unless you're talking over 100 gallons...I think your skimmer is going to cost the same regardless. A good skimmer will cost you $200-300. And...it will work on a 30 a 40, a 80, etc.

Lights...kind of the same thing. Smaller tank will be a LITTLE cheaper...but you're still talking the difference between $300 or $400 (example). While you're saving $100...you're STILL spending a couple hundred.

Live Rock? Well...this IS where a smaller tank will be cheaper...but you could always buy the same amount of Live Rock you'd get for a 30 gallon...and suppliment the rest with Base Rock (much cheaper). In 3-6 months, you won't be able to tell the differences. The Base rock will have BECOME Live rock.

My overall point is...yes...a smaller tank might be cheaper...but only marginally so. In the overall scheme...when all is said and done, you may save a couple hundred...but you'll still have spend a couple thousand, so that couple hundred really isn't much of a dent.

Again...it's just MY opinion. And I tend to tweak my financial logic to justify the obscene amounts of money I've spent in this hobby...so my opinion might not be the best one. hahahaha

Either way, welcome to the hobby, and good luck!!

Keep the questions comin...and post some pics when you can!
__________________
skeety is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006, 12:17 PM   #5
tdwyatt
senior member
 
tdwyatt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Walnut Grove, SC, USA
Posts: 13,643
Images: 3
Quote:
Originally Posted by skeety
...I tend to tweak my financial logic to justify the obscene amounts of money I've spent in this hobby...so my opinion might not be the best one. hahahaha!


obscene amounts of money... LOLOL!
__________________
Tom <"))))>(
(TDWyatt)
Wise men speak because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something. -Plato
tdwyatt is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
base rock



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Sitemap:1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190
Sponsor Our Community

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:27 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Our lawyer tells us that, by pressing the "New Thread" or "New Reply" button, you acknowledge that the opinions and information expressed in your article are yours alone and not those of thereeftank.com, dba The Reef Tank. Further, you agree to indemnify The Reef Tank, its moderators, administrators and agents from any and all liability which may arise as a result of your article. (C)opyright 2006 TheReefTank.com