Still confused I suppose!

[balakoth]

Just a quick question regarding sandbeds. Obviously there are many out there who dont like DSB or the fine grain sand period, either A because its impossible to keep settled in high flow tanks with SPS (well not impossible but for new tanks I could see it being a heck of ap roblem) and that its not nessecarily what is found on some reefs (Though Ive never been diving where all those pretty Acros grow so I havent a clue on that)


I just spent a week adding over time about another 1 1/2 " to my sandbed making it about 3 1/2 to 5 inches in places. At some points its even lower because of the pistol shrimps inability to sit still! (Little bugger).

Im curious, did I just waste a buttload of sand and time to try and achieve a denitrifcation area in my display? I will eventualy add a refugium but for now my Nitrates are at 40ppm (slowly coming down with reduced feedings and I am going to water change a few times this week).

It does actually look a bit more attractive now with a heavier amount of sand I just didnt wnat to go as far as 5 inches up in my display. That high and it starts to look bad to me. Most of the 4 to 5 area inches are in the back and I am sure will settle out over time.

Also, where can I find some good demographical descriptions/pictures of reefs where large colonies or even any colonies period of Hard SPS Corals are kept?



Thanks in Advance!


- Joe

[HuBu]

you do know that if you have a lot of depth, theres no current thru all that layer of sand. so the sand on the bottom are just sitting there. so the more sand you add, it doesnt mean that youll have a better denitrifcation area.

[galleon]

Balakoth,

Two tricks to making a sandbed a denitrification tool... The first is bioturbation by sandbed infauna to exchange water in the sandbed very very slowly. The second is making sure that no light enters the sandbed from the sides or underneath. This allows algae to grow under the sand bed much more easily than if light was only entering from directly above. Algae means too much oxygen for denitrification.
Hope this helps.
Chris

[balakoth]

Actually that helps alot Chris. So in an essence its not nessacarily the depth of the sandbed, but the infuana, exchange rate of water, and the ability to keep oxygen from certain portions of your bed?

I guess I am so confused because even Dr. Ron himself gives contradictory answers from what he says on his board and in his book.

You have a no less than "4 rules from him, as at 4 inches the area of no oxygen is greater and more available to your sandbed. Yet he says even with 3 inches and a super fine grain can achieve a denitrification process because of the surface area you are still providing.

As for keeping light from the sides, that seems like an almost horrid task. Especially since i didnt want to throw up my bed 5 inches into my display I would have to build some sort of barrier around the sandbed as tall it is now anyways to keep light from the sides.

Im just tired of asking Dr. Ron for his "DSB" advice and exterpise to only have him lead me in 4 different directions at once as if he couldnt make up his mind about his own research and observations. The man critisizes some of the more popular reef books out there that most of us learn from.


Ive pretty much come to the conclusion I will stick with the two most helpfull "scientific source here" Chris and Tom. Maybe then I can figure out this whole biological system MYSELF in a way I can understand it.


Basically Im afraid I have caused just more room for my Nitrates and Detrius to build up in my sandbed rather than providing a means for nitrite/nitrate export.


Thanks for your info and anything you guys would like to chime in!

- Joe

[balakoth]

oh BTW, I have some small patches in about 3 places of Algae and maybe a patch of what i think is Cyano. I believe alot of it was from when I added the sand in the first place and totally neglected to scrap it away. Should I push the sand back and proceed to do this next cleaning?

I dont have many words in my tank, and the few stores around here either dont believe in DSBs or their LIve Sand looks newer than mine with no life in it what so ever.

[Doug1]

Deep sand bed work if they are seeded with infauna and the like and not subject to the ravages of burrowing fish or inverts. A lot of people use a thi layer of larger grained live sand to seed it and help hold the fine stuff in place. This works well in relatively slow current setup, but is hard to do in a truly high energy SPS environment. THen again any tank is a compromise

[hesaias]

I have a DSB in my 58 gallon tank. It consists of 80lbs of oolitic sand, and 50 lbs of caribbian live sand. I also have around 1200 gph of flow in my tank. The sand doesnt blow around, it does move on the surface slightly. I have worms in the sand, Nassarius snails, 2 conchs and some scarlet reef goats to move the stuff around. I can see cyano growing below the surface of the sand, and from all I can find out, this is a sign the bed is growing. Tiny bubbles and worm tubes are good signs too. I think that a plenum and a DSB sometimes get confused with each other. Both use fine sand, but the mechanics of the two are very different.

BTW, Dr Ron said he wouldt make a sand bed like I did, but He didnt say it wouldnt work. If yopu get the booklet "sand bed secrets, he pretty much spells out his method, but its not the only method.

Leave the cyano, and you can get LS online, as well as Detrivore kits and DSB starter kits from IPSF. I got my sand from Gulf View for about 1.25 a pound. It was loaded with tiny starfish, worms and snails. I was dissapointed when i first saw it because Iit wasnt what I had invisioned, but now I would buy it again in a second.