Review this basic plumbing config

landshark · 10-06-2006, 07:05 PM

Bonus room off garage will have 45g sump 1.5 inch BH with
Sequence 4300SW to push 8' to 10' all 1.5 inch plumbed with
1.5 inch gate value on return line diameter obviously smaller when
I look through the gate value center ?

Two 1.5 inch overflows BH's from 150g main tank with 34 linear inches
of internal overflow teeth... BTW, how thick is Internal Overflow acrylic
need to be on such a main tank ?

Anybody know how loud this pump is going to be ? I'll know during my
garage test very soon ...

Do I try to keep all plumbing 1.5 inch until return hits main tank in some manner, ie., 3way 4way motions device or such ?

Thanks for your input ....

Fly Guy · 10-06-2006, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by landshark

Bonus room off garage will have 45g sump 1.5 inch BH with
Sequence 4300SW to push 8' to 10' all 1.5 inch plumbed with
1.5 inch gate value on return line diameter obviously smaller when
I look through the gate value center ?

Two 1.5 inch overflows BH's from 150g main tank with 34 linear inches
of internal overflow teeth... BTW, how thick is Internal Overflow acrylic
need to be on such a main tank ?

Anybody know how loud this pump is going to be ? I'll know during my
garage test very soon ...

Do I try to keep all plumbing 1.5 inch until return hits main tank in some manner, ie., 3way 4way motions device or such ?

Thanks for your input ....

I guess i would start by asking why such a big return pump???

What kind of skimmer do you plan on running???

If you do do a OM 4-way or similar what pump do you intend on running it with???

FWIW, im a huge oceans motions fan. I run OM 8-ways on both my 90 and my 225. Sweet random flow with no visible plumbing. That pump would be much better served for running your cls than your return. Im not familiar with that specific one but i know my sequence dart is the quietest pump ive ever seen.

Ill wait for answers to those questions. : )

Fly Guy · 10-06-2006, 07:35 PM

edit...i just went and looked at that pump.........

i was thinking 4300 gph...its only 2000...its a nice pump although depending on what skimmer you plan on using i still think its too big for your return and too small for your CLS unless you were going to use eductors, which wont work with a OM device.

IF you were going to T off of it and run a chiller and possibly a canister filter for carbon or something with the same pump it might work pretty darn well flowwise for a return then.....again, depending on your skimmer

landshark · 10-06-2006, 07:49 PM

Ouch.... How'd you get 2000 gph from

Specifications:

Flow Rate: 1200-4300gph
Flow Rate @ 4` Head: 3900gph
Max Head: 20ft
Ave. Amps/Watts @115V: 2A/225W
Motor Speed: 1/6hp
Inlet/Outlet: 1.5"/1.5"
Dimensions (W x H): 12.86" x 8.33" x 7.54"

Manufacturer Warranty: 3 years from date of purchase.

Maybe it will become my CLS engine ...

What PanWorld would you folks recommend for my return to maybe a OM X-ways keeping in mind I have to push water 8' 10' feet and want maximum GPH turnover ? What Skimmer setup would help facilitate ? Haven't aquired yet, remember I'm playing in the garage still :-) ...

Fly Guy · 10-06-2006, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by landshark

Ouch.... How'd you get 2000 gph from

Specifications:

Flow Rate: 1200-4300gph
Flow Rate @ 4` Head: 3900gph
Max Head: 20ft
Ave. Amps/Watts @115V: 2A/225W
Motor Speed: 1/6hp
Inlet/Outlet: 1.5"/1.5"
Dimensions (W x H): 12.86" x 8.33" x 7.54"

Manufacturer Warranty: 3 years from date of purchase.

Maybe it will become my CLS engine ...

What PanWorld would you folks recommend for my return to maybe a OM X-ways keeping in mind I have to push water 8' 10' feet and want maximum GPH turnover ? What Skimmer setup would help facilitate ? Have aquired yet, remember I'm playing in the garage still :-) ...

It was the first google that came up on the pump...........

anyways ......so know we know what the pump does

, it would be a good pump fopr your cls with a OM unit. Although if you havent yet purchased this pump, for maximum GPH turnover i would get a bigger pump moving against that much head

How much turnover do you want?? Ive got 60x on my bb tank and 35x on my DSB tank. Both of those work well for me, but it is a very subjective question relevant to not only how much you want but how you plumb it.

do you have a have a link to a head chart.....i read 3900 at 4'...whats it do at 10'?? Keep in mind too that when plumbing a OM unit into a CLS your actual head pressure is going to be a whole lot more than ten with variables from fitting, what kind of pipe you use and if you have the OM unit down below or mounted on the back of the tank forking off of it there. I imagine you are planning on putting the OM unit down with the sump and you will have a WHOLE lot more than the simple ten feet of head working against you

As far as the return pump, we need to have a skimmer first to figure it out IMO. I like Euroreefs and ASM's becasue they run themselves with no tinkering, but you can do a little bit better of a job with a beckett of some kind. I think a ASM G4+ would work great for that tank if it will fit in the sump

landshark · 10-06-2006, 08:35 PM

In my naive thinking, based on locale of main tank and corner location, I could just get a bunch of water to the top back of tank with powerful pump and OM x-ways from there as back of tank has easily a foot of room nobody will see .... Do OM devices normally come from sump or setup near top of tank ?

Could you give me just one more piece of the puzzle regarding the Skimmer in the sump ? I see 1.5 inch (volume from two of them feeding almost full force into the sump input area ... The skimmer has mag-? or sedra ? pump pulling from the input area and outputting through skimmer exit point ? How does that effect all the water leaving via 1.5 in BH to return pump ? Any water not being feed into the skimmer just goes around it to the sump exit correct ? Sorry newbie here ... Thanks again ...

Fly Guy · 10-06-2006, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by landshark

In my naive thinking, based on locale of main tank and corner location, I could just get a bunch of water to the top back of tank with powerful pump and OM x-ways from there as back and of tank has easily a foot of room nobody will see .... Do OM devices normally come from sump or setup near top of tank ?

Could give me just one more piece of the puzzle regarding the Skimmer in the sump ? I see 1.5 inch (volume from two of them feeding almost full force into the sump input area ... The skimmer has mag-? or sedra ? pump pulling from the input area and outputting through skimmer exit point ? How does that effect all the water leaving via 1.5 in BH to return pump ? Any water not being feed into the skimmer just goes around it to the sump exit correct ? Sorry newbie here ... Thanks again ...

Most OM set-ups are set up with the unit under the tank or elsewhere that i have seen. I set both of mine up a little differently sitting vertically in the back of my tanks..........regardless of how you do it, there is still substantial head loss with them due to the extra pipe friction from more pipe and turns and twists. you can alleviate some of this by using flex pipe but IMO a lot of what is gained is lost due to the fact that flex pvc itself creates more frioction as the inside of the pipe isnt all that smooth in comparison to regular pipe.

Im not sure exactly what you are asking in that second paragraph. It is best to run roughly the same amount of water volume through your sump as you skimmer can process. In the case of a ASM G4+, it uses a sedra 9000, running 900 gph, so ideally, your return pump would match that.

I dont use refugiums or put anything in my sumps besides equipment so its real easy for me to simple set them up so that the tank drains into one side fo the sump by the skimmer, then through some baffles then to the return pump. Its of course not 100% efficient in processing ALL of the water but Im not sure ive ever seen one that is.......it does a pretty efficient job at processing the majority of the water without being very complicated.

Geoff · 10-06-2006, 09:35 PM

Great advice so far!!

even thought Sedra 9000 is rated at 900gph, that is not even close to what it is actually doing when used in a skimmer. most are used in needlewheel form. you are lucky to get 500gph out of them in this configuration. those fins on a needlewheel are horribly inefficient at actually pushing water.

G~

landshark · 10-07-2006, 02:19 AM

Oso ! .... I'm starting to get the idea.... Seeking 20 times turnover doesn't mean from the overflows to sump and back ? Skimmer throughput to return pump rating should be matched where possilble ... and having a CLS turnover mega mucho times per hour would do the trick! I always planned to have two external pumps working, just not sure who was pumping where :-( Thanks to all for your input .... Been a big help ..

Now a new thread on plumbing 101 ...

Pauli · 10-07-2006, 08:30 AM

I post in your other thread before I read this one.

I think this is the flow chart for your pump.

At 12 feet of head you are still at 2700 gph. Should have enough to spare to run a chiller and maybe even your skimmer. I have the Sequence Wahoo pump in their Reeflo series. Not nearly as powerful as this one and I run my return and chiller with it. As I said in the other thread I tried to get away with reducing the inlet piping to make it more convenient but I ended up with microbubbles, caused by cavitation, until I plumbed with lagrer fittings. As for noise, mine is very quiet. I barely know that it is running.

Unless I have something wrong with my setup, I have had to reduce the flow to my tank because my returns cannot handle the flow if I open the pump up.

Fly Guy · 10-07-2006, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by landshark

Oso ! .... I'm starting to get the idea.... Seeking 20 times turnover doesn't mean from the overflows to sump and back ? Skimmer throughput to return pump rating should be matched where possilble ... and having a CLS turnover mega mucho times per hour would do the trick! I always planned to have two external pumps working, just not sure who was pumping where :-( Thanks to all for your input .... Been a big help ..

Now a new thread on plumbing 101 ...