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Old 11-21-2007, 10:56 AM   #1
Hendersonracing
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Question about phosphate remover?


A friend of mine has probably the best looking tank Ive seen in Chicago

he has been using Seachem Phosphate remover for a long time....its the white pellets...so I thought Id give it a shot and see how it does....


I began to notice all my algae in the tank disapear so I figured it was doing its job..I also began to notice my Alk dropping in the 7'sh range on DKH and became a little worried so I turned my reactor up to bring the alk up...well I have done a few water changes and not ran the media and my alk was up to 13dkh this morning....I have been told that the phosphate remover has aluminum in it and it can be bad on the tank?????any help is appreciated....I have removed most of the corals and brought them here to work to try to keep them from bleaching???? what should I do??? also the calcium was at 500?


I turned my reactor off to try to bring things back down to normal?
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Old 11-21-2007, 12:23 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by Hendersonracing View Post
I began to notice all my algae in the tank disapear so I figured it was doing its job..I also began to notice my Alk dropping in the 7'sh range on DKH and became a little worried so I turned my reactor up to bring the alk up...well I have done a few water changes and not ran the media and my alk was up to 13dkh this morning....I have been told that the phosphate remover has aluminum in it and it can be bad on the tank?????any help is appreciated....I have removed most of the corals and brought them here to work to try to keep them from bleaching???? what should I do??? also the calcium was at 500?


...I turned my reactor off to try to bring things back down to normal?


Joe,

Although I am not familiar with the composition of this particular product (as I have never used the Seachem product), if it is indeed aluminum, it will be problematic for both alkalinity (alumin exchange resins + alkalinity = alumin carbonate) and for Sarcophyton spp. in the tank. If you system is stony corals, then the drop in alk is not good, if your tank has softies (octocorals), then the aluminum salts are not good. I do not know this for fact, but I would think that this product is intended as a means of controlling phosphate for FO systems rather than coral reef systems (which will work better with judicious use of Granular Ferric Hydroxide products as a means of reducing free phospohate in the tank).

Keep in mind that phosphate removers must react with free phosphate in the water column to do their job, so this does not mean that they have removed all phosphate in the system when they appear to do their job via water testing. Most phosphates in the tank will reside either as adsorbed phosphates (to calcareous substrates like aragonite sand and live rock up to 30% w/w), as polyphosphate polymers, as organophosphates and related compounds (primarily residing in algal biomass), or as part of aminophosphates (as part of protein/amino acid biomass in the tank for fishes, inverts, and especially bacterial biomass). These sources may still act like sinks in the tank, only providing free phosphates when they are acted on by some chemical conditions which increase solubility (like your anaerobic portions of the sandbed as they acidify) or the activity of phosphatase enzymes (remember, bacteria do not have mouths, they must release enzymes and create a "soup" in which they live to absorb nutrients through their external membranes), or algal thallus degradation when macroalgae go "sexual" (or cyanobacteria die off each evening). It is through these releases of free phosphate that many algae gain their phosphate needs, including those algae that have facultative absorption of phosphate in excess of their physiological needs (and store it for times of low free phosphate). This allows for some spp of algae to be resistant to phosphate reduction as a means of control, so it becomes imperative under these resistant infestations to remove the algal biomass as a means of exporting the excessive amounts of phosphate that these thalli contain.


More later if you want it.



Personally I would test both your calcium and your alkalinity as well as your Mg before making any more adjustments to the calcium reactor, especially after using any product that uses either adsorptive resins or exchange resins as their means of function to remove ions from the water column, along with some big water changes.



HTH
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Old 11-21-2007, 07:51 PM   #3
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hey Tom, i was at Aquarium Oddities today and was talking to the owner about Phosphate remover (i run the white pellets in mine) he said the white (aluminum) is not good for some types of reef tanks (like stonies) and that the brown (iron based) is ok, and is preferable to use in any reef tank.. any truth to this?

edit... if i would have fully read the first paragraph, my question would have been answered... once again... thank alot Tom
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Old 11-21-2007, 08:03 PM   #4
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he said the white (aluminum) is not good for some types of reef tanks (like stonies) and that the brown (iron based) is ok, and is preferable to use in any reef tank.. any truth to this?
Pick your poison.

Aluminum is way worse than iron.

Im not even going to try to answer the question as Tom would....thats all you get from me
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Old 11-21-2007, 08:53 PM   #5
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Pick your poison.

Aluminum is way worse than iron.
I like this answer! succinct and to the point!
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Old 11-21-2007, 10:54 PM   #6
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well I was wrong...I tested again tonight and it was 8.5dkh...I think I added 3 drops of solution instead of 2...lol but I am done with the phosphate removers..everytime someone talkes me into using this stuff I have issues?...Im just going to keep doing 10% wc till all the aluminum is removed from the water...
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Old 11-21-2007, 11:54 PM   #7
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I used the Seachem Phosphate Remover for a long time with no ill effects ( that were apparant ). I ran mostly LPS with a sand bed.
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Old 11-22-2007, 12:08 AM   #8
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i'm currently using phosban and i'm not seeing any ill effects at this point. My stuff's actually looking way better
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Old 11-22-2007, 12:13 AM   #9
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i'm currently using phosban and i'm not seeing any ill effects at this point. My stuff's actually looking way better
a little warning........you just went BB. drop your dose of how much of that stuff you are using regardless of how much or little it happens to be, and then taper it back up if you want....

You dont have that sandbed cushion anymore .....

I only say that because I never had a problem with the stuff either.......until I went BB in the one tank......
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Old 11-22-2007, 03:19 PM   #10
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thanks bill
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Old 11-22-2007, 04:47 PM   #11
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I use this stuff it brought down my Phosphates from .5 to 0 in less then a week. It is the brown pellets that you were explaining in the post above. i used about 2 table spoons in a media bag and took away all the agea. i had Hair Algae comming out of a return pump, within a week it was all gone. left it in my tank for about 1 month before i decided to take it out. Seamed like it could have kept absorbing more impurities.
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Old 11-22-2007, 05:34 PM   #12
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my 75 gallon reef tank at work has all kinds of algae in it and the sps are growing at 3 times the rate under 250 watt than my 210 gallon at 400 watt with no trace of any algae!! so I think algae needs to be present at some degree!
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