PLAN PLAN PLAN! Ok! Lets Start!

Mnemic · 08-22-2002, 05:00 PM

Hello everyone, I’ve been planning out my aquarium, and I’ve got tons of questions that I’m still looking up, but have a preliminary setup idea going. My first goal is to get the Tank up and cycled. After that I’ll worry about corals and critters.

Let me set some goals for my tank as well, as to help with the suggestions of equipment and whatnot.

1) I want to make the tank as simple to maintain as possible (Don’t we all). I Will be getting a AquaController2 to help maintain many of the system basics. It will be implemented before Corals and Fish are used, but after initial Setup. I am Very familiar with X-10 technology, and should be a snap for me to implement, as I have x10 stuff laying around, and I can program the AC2 for anything I need as well.

2) I want to use as few chemicals as possible. I like for things to happen naturaly. I say this because I do not know if I will need a Calcium Reactor or what all I will need to help achieve this goal. Its only 75 Gallons and it may not be practical to add. That’s the type of information I’m looking for. What would be practical to add to aid in achieving this goal? I’ve read that 1.5 Lbs of Live rock per gallon is recommended.. is this true?

3) I want to keep as many varieties of life that is within reason of the tank. Hard/Soft Corals, various fish, etc..etc.. With that in mind, I’m looking for Equipment recommendations as well.

4) I want to plan on a Bigger tank eventualy too.

I will be taking my time in doing this project, and I will be doing it very slowly, as that has been stressed heavily, and I am taking that piece of advice very seriously…

With all that said, here is what I'm planning. This is going to be the Basic Setup.

[Updated]
75 Gallon Tank (48 long 18 wide 24 Deep)
20 Gallon Sump (under tank, with Skimmer attached to it)
2 150 Watt Heaters
2 VHOs (unsure of Size, position, and Wattage in Tank)
2 MHs (just about 100% unsure about anything with these)
MR1 Skimmer with MAG1200 pump.
Looking into 2 MAG700s parallel running a CLS in the Aquarium hood for Circulation.
90 Lbs Live rock
4 to 5 Inches of sand (Seeded with Live Sand)

Now for circulation, I’m wanting to do something that will allow me to keep pumps external to the tank. So later on it will be easy to maintain, and replace them if needed. So I’m looking for suggestions on how many of what size, and what kind of pumps to use for my setup.

[Update]
Going to attempt a CLS system in the Canopy for bulk of the circulation.

Lighting, I’ve seen many Tanks running this combination, and its totally open to changes as well.

I've managed to fill some of the puzzle of starting a tank, but with many questions left as well, (more then what I started with) and I've been reading anything I can get my eyes on, but that allmost confuses me more, becuase theres 1000s of ways to do this.

Thanks for all input in advance!

-Paul

[Edit for Update in Equipment list]

biomekanic · 08-22-2002, 05:47 PM

sump: bigger is always better
have you thought about a refugium?

as for lighting, the question is what do you want to eventually keep in it? you should design the tank around the needs of the animals not vice versa.

I'd advise picking a biotope and trying to replicate it, making replacements where it's a lot more convient. for example, using green chromis instead of the native dither fish if doing a Caribbean tank.

Aqua Clear makes good skimmers, and one of our new sponsors does too.

I'd make the sand bed deeper.

a lot of the rock depends on what type you use. really dense FL aquacultured: get more. Light and fluffy Fiji: sounds right to me.

one thing to think about, and it's a pain for us American's to generally do is let the tank sit. On the large system I want to do, I plan putting in the LR and sand and letting it lie fallow for a year till the LR has a chance to really take off.

HTH

Minnreefer · 08-22-2002, 05:54 PM

Sounds like you are thinking straight.

1. A controller is handy and usefull but not needed, if budget is a high priority then don't spend the money at first. IMHO (I do have one on our tank)

2. As you add corals, you will need to keep the calcium up in your tank, a calcium reactor is the easiest way to do that, but you don't need that at the start. We just do water changes to add the trace elements.

3. Your basic equipment sounds good, I would go with the 660 version of the VHO for more flexability in the future. I would prob recomend either 10K or higher for MH. but I would really recomend looking at different bulb combos for lights. 75#'s of rock may be a bit low, you may want to get a little bit more. YOu don't need 3-4inches of live sand, you only need a little bit of "live" sand on top to sead the sand bed.

4. I would recomend a good external pump for circulation and return from the sump. Many people like Ampmasters for external pumps. I would pump that to 1 or 2 sea swirls wich would add good circulation.

Quote:

I've been reading anything I can get my eyes on, but that allmost confuses me more, becuase theres 1000s of ways to do this

that is one of the good and bad things about this hobby.

HTH

Jon

P.S. please keep asking questions

mapster · 08-22-2002, 06:24 PM

Mnemic,
Sounds like you have been doing some good research/reading. You are making the right decision with taking things slowly.

I want to use as few chemicals as possible. I like for things to happen naturaly. I say this because I do not know if I will need a Calcium Reactor or what all I will need to help achieve this goal. Its only 75 Gallons and it may not be practical to add. That’s the type of information I’m looking for. What would be practical to add to aid in achieving this goal?

Calcium is one of the few supplements needed in most cases. Whether it be a calcium reactor, kalkwasser or other additives the goal is to maintain calcium levels between 400-500ppm. The average salt mix will not acheive this goal. In a SPS dominant tank with clams and such a calcium reactor may almost be a must. In a mixed tank however, one could do without one. I have a 120g mixed tank (mostly LPS) and maintain my calcium at the proper levels using a kalk drip. To get my calcium levels to where they should be I used B-Ionic 2 part calcium and alkalinity (another imporatant level that will need to be maintained), this product works well and is highly recommended through-out the hobby. The B-Ionic can be used alone to maintain your calcium levels, but the cost factor is a little high. Thats just what I do, different thing work for different set-ups, but something will have to be done to maintain proper calcium and alkalinity levels.

I’ve read that 1.5 Lbs of Live rock per gallon is recommended.. is this true?

1-2 lbs is a pretty accurate rule of thumb.

I want to plan on a Bigger tank eventualy too.

Dont we all!

20 Gallon Sump
The bigger the better!

2 200 Watt Heaters
May be a little overkill. I have 2 150W heaters on my tank and that does the trick. I would say save your money and go with the 150W or even the 100W, but thatmay be pushing it.

2 VHOs /2 MHs
Sound good. The wattage of the depends on the depth of your tank if its under 24" 250W's should do, If its 24" or over you may want to jump up to 400w.

Skimmer
Get as large a skimmer as you can afford now, so when you upgrade to a larger tank you wont need to replace it.

75 Lbs Live rock (will this be enough?)
I would try to fit a few more pounds in if I were you. 90lbs would be nice and shouldnt look too crowded.

3 to 4.5 Inches of live sand
You'll be glad you did. A DSB is a great way of natural filtration. FWIW, you wont need to create the entire sand bed from live sand. You can use "dead" sand (fine grain aragonite) and either top it with a layer of live sand or let the life come from your LR.

Now for circulation, I’m wanting to do something that will allow me to keep pumps external to the tank. So later on it will be easy to maintain, and replace them if needed. So I’m looking for suggestions on how many of what size, and what kind of pumps to use for my setup.

Do a search for "closed loop" and you should find the info your looking for. Ive never set one up so I cant be of much help there.

I've managed to fill some of the puzzle of starting a tank, but with many questions left as well, (more then what I started with) and I've been reading anything I can get my eyes on, but that allmost confuses me more, becuase theres 1000s of ways to do this.

Everyone has there own way of doing things, as you progress you'll find out what works best for you. Keep up the good work, sound like your doing everything right!

Keep asking questions too, there are a lot of pro's here who graciously help others progress in the hobby.

HTH

MAP

Mnemic · 08-22-2002, 10:16 PM

Doing some research on Closed Loop Systesms (CLS) I've seen many people asking about where to get pumps cheaply for them.. well would it be possible to run 2 smaller units in parallel?

This seems very benificial for the fact that you can use a smaller Cheaper (maybe not as cheap as 1 Pump) but you get redunancy for when one of them goes out, and usualy smaller pumps can be found at LFS in emergency situations.

for my 75 Gal I'm going to try and do a CLS, and Would like to use two 700 GPH Pumps running in parallel.

If I Do go the CLS Way, how does that affect my other things like Sump, and what not. is a Big sump still as important? should I run the sump and the CLS together?

and on lighting... I've found some VHO kits that look VERY appealing, but its like a $20 diffrence from 2 bulbs to 4. This will be in a Custom Canopy that I'm building and I'm wanting to integrate the CLS and lights into the unit. Should I get the 4 Bulb set? if so what kind of lighting (watts) should I run?

I see recomendations on having MH lights 8" from the surface, but that would make a canopy really tall, I assume its ok to have them lower though.....

And what would be a better Setup for the lights in the canopy?
(ASCII ART TIME!)

Code:

<----------------------------------->

        VVVVVVVVVHHHHHOOOOOOOO

       MMMMHHHH        MMMMHHHH

        VVVVVVVVVHHHHHOOOOOOOO
     
<----------------------------------->

or Maybe

Code:

<----------------------------------->
      V                         V     
      V     M            M      V            
      H     M            M      H        
      H     H            H      H          
      O     H            H      O           
      O                         O   
<----------------------------------->

Ohh so many questions....

Geoff · 08-22-2002, 10:49 PM

Wow, a person who is as old schooled as I am on forums.

I love ASCII art.

I have found if you have the time to spend, you can DIY most of the equipment. Anything from under $100 MH. to $30 skimmers. There are all kinds of info out there on DIY. Most of them you have to me confident in your ability to make modifications upon their mods, due to what you can find. I like the DIY stuff, because I am cheap, and it keeps me from rushing things. I can work on a bigger skimmer while my tank cycles.

I have been looking at several inexpensive pumps for my CLS. ViaAqua makes cheap pumps that look like candidates for a CLS. The connection might not be quite as easy as lets say a Mag Drive with standard NPT connectors, but hey where's the fun in that.

The important thing is the patience. After that do what seems to make sense to you. All your ideas sound sound.
As for your hood setup the first one is most prefered. They both look good on paper, but when you actually get those MH in your hands you realize just how long they are. It is also difficult to get an even lighting across the tank with those VHO's in that orientation. You also need as much room around those MH as possible for cooling.

Ok, my hands are tired.

G~

billc · 08-22-2002, 11:16 PM

ascii art... have not seen that in years.. used to love in till ansi came around..

I personaly would go with door # 1.. I have seen a couple of posts here on CLS with some real good ideas.. Might do a search.. You will need a good pump to do it, if you want to get rid of the powerheads.. Seems like you are going about this the right way..

Minnreefer · 08-23-2002, 07:30 AM

Doing some research on Closed Loop Systesms (CLS) I've seen many people asking about where to get pumps cheaply for them.. well would it be possible to run 2 smaller units in parallel?

This seems very benificial for the fact that you can use a smaller Cheaper (maybe not as cheap as 1 Pump) but you get redunancy for when one of them goes out, and usualy smaller pumps can be found at LFS in emergency situations

I would recomend making 2 seperate closed loop systems insted of the 2 pumps together.

If I Do go the CLS Way, how does that affect my other things like Sump, and what not. is a Big sump still as important? should I run the sump and the CLS together

NO, a closed loop is a seperate plumbing system that does not need the sump.

and on lighting... I've found some VHO kits that look VERY appealing, but its like a $20 diffrence from 2 bulbs to 4. This will be in a Custom Canopy that I'm building and I'm wanting to integrate the CLS and lights into the unit. Should I get the 4 Bulb set? if so what kind of lighting (watts) should I run?

That would be a lot of light but I would get the 4 bulb set

I see recomendations on having MH lights 8" from the surface, but that would make a canopy really tall, I assume its ok to have them lower though.....

NO, the biggest problem with MH is water can get on them from waves, or salt spray etc and makes them burst

, so you need them at least 6" off the water level

And what would be a better Setup for the lights in the canopy?
(ASCII ART TIME!)

Code:

<-----------------------------------> VVVVVVVVVHHHHHOOOOOOOO MMMMHHHH MMMMHHHH VVVVVVVVVHHHHHOOOOOOOO <----------------------------------->

or Maybe

Code:

<-----------------------------------> V V V M M V H M M H H H H H O H H O O O <----------------------------------->

Ohh so many questions.... archive

PLAN PLAN PLAN! Ok! Lets Start!

Just my thoughts/opinions