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Old 01-13-2003, 12:20 PM   #1
ctel
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other sands for DSB?


well dosnt look like im going to get southdown sand, i've heard of using sandblasting sand. What are some other options for sand that wont cost $20 for 50lbs. thanks Corey
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Old 01-13-2003, 12:24 PM   #2
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I have read that regular tan colored Play Sand is usable, i have no idea about any silica issues that may be connected with it... its $2.59 for 50# up here....

i had asked about Black Beauty coal slag sand at another site, didn't get much input except that the particles are exceptionally sharp.
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Old 01-13-2003, 12:41 PM   #3
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iam assumeing based on some current readings that any silca contained in the sand will be much harder for algae to use then say the silica that is contained in the glass of the tank itself. my conclusion is that what the sand is made of wont dictate amounts of algae. so out side of particle size does it really matter what sand we use?

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Old 01-13-2003, 01:10 PM   #4
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ctel , you check out my reply to your other post about SD?
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Old 01-13-2003, 01:14 PM   #5
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is there any concern for sharpness?
and does anyone know ifBlack Beauty is ok or will it leach out nasties?
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Old 01-13-2003, 01:18 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by aquaticsdeptleader
...my conclusion is that what the sand is made of wont dictate amounts of algae. so out side of particle size does it really matter what sand we use?
Hey Jim, prolly not much of a problem, although certain types of river sand contain organosilicates that are much more soluble than plain silicon dioxide. In actuality, hardness has nothing to do with the availability of the silica/silicate for diatom blooms (the biggest problem for aquaria use), but rather it's solubility. Glass as such is prolly less soluble than river sand (somewhere on the level of 3mcg/l, quite INSOLUBLE) and accounts for its use in analytical chemistry (so that it does not react with the substances being tested). The multitude of different silicates found in differing grades of river and beach sands will definitely provide more silicate to the water column, so I would think that a mined source of relatively pure sand would be desirable as opposed to river sand, or any sand contaminated with feldspars, etc.

Particle size is prolly the largest single determinator in selecting a substrate. The use of calcium carbonate based sands (aragonite or calcite) would be preferential, as they both mimic both Caribbean and Indo-Pacific substrates more closely. Although many folks use a fine grade (sugar sized) of sand such as Aragamax or Southdown, It would prolly be best to see a multitude of particle sizes from 2mm down to 0.5mm with some occasional larger particle sizes for creatures that require them (for building burrows, etc). Dr. Ron has several articles on sandbed particle sizes, as well as those by Rob Toonen and a few other folks (I am starting to wonder about the impartiality of Bob Goeman's work... ). Basically we don't want something down to the size of silt, but anything larger than sugar sized substrates begin to dramatically reduce surface area available to colonizing bacteria/algae, etc. The ability of carbonate substrates to buffer the water column does count towards its selection as the substrate of choice, however, this function is greatly reduced by the presence of a biofilm of benthic microorganisms by the time the tank begins to mature, and although creatures that digest this biofilm off the substrate (i.e., sea cukes, etc.) may temporarily remove this film, I am not sure that this contributes in a major way in view of the huge utilization of Ca and Alk by hermatypic corals in a closed system.

To answer your question, yes, SIZE DOES MATTER... , but the substrate of choice would still be sugar-sized aragonite, possibly a mixture of several granule sizes, but mostly those of the 1 to 2 mm size. I am sure that several folks will post links to the literature on this.

Hope this helps.
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Old 01-13-2003, 01:24 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by icebear
is there any concern for sharpness?
and does anyone know ifBlack Beauty is ok or will it leach out nasties?
IMO , i would pass on "close/wrong" types of sands,,
I'm sure many of us would have heard of using them ,if they would work.Southdown brand, or "Yard-Right"(marketed by SD), looks be the only other kind/brand of sand myself , and sure others have known to work in our tanks,,,as per my previous post about this subject, i went to thereefshop.com ,and got 500#+ for $5.25 a 40#bag from Mark. i see the price has gone up ,but from what i hear, supplies are possibly going to "dry up".
also ,like i said the HD a 1/4 mile away had SD stacked to the sky,when i stopped in there on a whim ,to look while i was waiting for the LFS to open,,,,
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Old 01-13-2003, 02:25 PM   #8
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Tom

thanks again for being a wonderful source of information to me. I understand that the size of the sand particles is the major factor for a sand bed. based on a recent response to a question posed to rob toonen (in thf i believe the ask the reefer section) about diatoms problems, he went into the availablity of silcate and that predomently daitoms would find that availablity in the glass of the aquirium. Based on this info i came to the conclusion that sand regardles of what it was would be fine for a tank. i however over looked the obvius the purity of the sand or source of the sand. the sand itself is find but the crude with it from collection site can be a problem (pointed out much more elquintly in your prededing post).

thanks

jim
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