Mollies & Hair Algae in SW Reef

[jenglish]

Originally Posted by zero186

thinking die off from the underside of rock?

Rock and sand are essentially the same material, PO4 in a sandbed can wick up into rock.

[bucket brigade]

jenglish....thanks for taking on this post & showing alot of concern.

here's more detail on what i've done to my tank over the last 6 weeks:

1) removed all sand, its down to BB
2) put two koralia4's in either corner of the tank at the bottom blowing water all around the tank. i've got all kinds of waterflow going on. churning all around the tank. its almost too much current IMO but my hammers flip-n-whip around and seem to love it.
3) used a 1200gph powerhead to blow debris completely off rocks (to the point where water-clarity was so bad you couldnt see but 3 inches into the water) but have done tons of water changes after blowing stuff off with PH
4) did the PH blowoff several times over the course of 3 weeks with tons of waterchanges

With the LR:
1) i've pulled 75% (150+lbs) of my LR a MONTH ago and put it in my laundry sink.
2) i scrubbed the LR with a stiff brush.
3) i soaked the LR in the sink (fully submerged) in RO water for 3 days.
4) Then drained, re-scrubbed, then soaked again for days.
5) repeated this whole process about 5, 6, 7 times. idk, lost count (over 4 weeks)
6) then put all LR on a towel out in my driveway and baked in the sun for 2 days.
7) the LR is now completely beached out (white looking). IMO everything is "dead" on the surface.

The other 25% of the LR I kept in the tank because it has ZOAS growing on them:
1) the GHA still keeps growing
2) i've reduced feeding to only 3 times a week by putting (1) mysis frozen cube each time. I only have a flame & a marine betta in the tank, no other fish.
3) i have two 250w 14k MHs hanging over a 75g std tank. the light are on only 4-5 hrs a day
4) i have a canister running carbon in one of the media baskets. no other media in the canister, no sponges, no ceramics, no other media.
5) i pull the canister once a week and completely rinse it out. i replace carbon in the media basket every 2 weeks.

I've tried a Sea Hare, only to find out it only eats slime and not hair. It shrank in half after a couplf of week.... so I quickly sold it locally to someone who could use it more efficiently

These four mollies are my LAST HOPE in stopping the GHA. But it will probably fail. And i'll end up with four dead mollies and GHA freaking everywhere.

Any other ideas?

I'm particularly interested to hear if my dried out LR is ready to go back in the tank!!!

[Mr.Peanut]

Do you thaw and rinse the mysis before adding? I hear the "juice" that they are in is essentially liquid phosphates.

[bucket brigade]

Originally Posted by Mr.Peanut

Do you thaw and rinse the mysis before adding? I hear the "juice" that they are in is essentially liquid phosphates.

nnnnnnnnnnope. but will start doing that immediately

[jenglish]

If the rock is already dead, I would go ahead and try one more step, a Muriatic acid dip. This may/or may not remove bound up PO4, people don't agree. I would say that it doesn't likely do as much as the true cooking process but it takes an afternoon rather than 3-6 months Acid is very dangerous, the vapors burn the lungs and throat, and for the love of all that is holy do not get it on you or anyone else. I had some very nasty rock from a dirty tank and I cooked afterwards but the acid dip made a huge difference in the smell of it.

[bucket brigade]

Originally Posted by jenglish

If the rock is already dead, I would go ahead and try one more step, a Muriatic acid dip.

okay.

where do you get muriatic acid?

how many "drops" per gallon of RO water?

my utility sink is made of plastic (got it from HomeDepot) will the acid solution damage this plastic tub/sink?

[jenglish]

Originally Posted by bucket brigade

okay.

where do you get muriatic acid?

how many "drops" per gallon of RO water?

my utility sink is made of plastic (got it from HomeDepot) will the acid solution damage this plastic tub/sink?

Home Improvement stores or pool supply stores. It is used to clean concrete, something in pools or decorative etching of steel. You get it in a gallon jug covered with warning labels It will not damage plastic, but will damage practically anything else. I filled a 5 gallon bucket w/ rock, added 1/2 gallon of acid and topped off with RO. I don't know if that was a lot or a little. It bubbled and made a fizz that looked like skimmate. I left it a few hours. Make sure you know where you are going to dispose of it and if any local laws apply for disposal. The acid does dissolve some of the rock but not enough to discern any difference in weight.

[bucket brigade]

I've decided NOT to go the way of Muriatic Acid. I jsut talked to a Pool Supply Store. happened to talk to the owner of this store who also has a reef tank and he is afraid my LR I dip in the Muriatic Acid would lower my pH in my reeftank once the LR was put back in (even after rinsing it several time)

the mollies are now in the tank. they are hiding in the upper corners of the tank. their breathing is a little fast but not to the point where i'm concerned.

i did happen to see one molly swim down to the bottom of the tank and eat a clump of GHA and then return to the upper corner. an encouraging sign...but still not convinced until they are all happily swimming about and munching on GHA

[Mr.Peanut]

Give them some time.

Maybe you should skip a feeding so they "get hungry"

[bucket brigade]

Originally Posted by Mr.Peanut

Give them some time.

Maybe you should skip a feeding so they "get hungry"

not a problem here. i'm down to only feeding my tank 1 mysis frozen cube every 3rd day after putting the mysis in a fishnet and THOROUGHLY rinsing the mysis. besides the mollies, there is a marine betta and a flame and no other fish. my betta probably caused all this since its a big pooper.

i'm SCARED to death the mollies will eat the mysis shrimp & lose interests in the GHA. thats all I need are four mollies eating the WRONG stuff. but this is what will probably happen. i'm about to take a baseball bat to the tank. pounding everything into fine particles might be the ultimate solution here.

[Mr.Peanut]

Originally Posted by bucket brigade

i'm about to take a baseball bat to the tank. pounding everything into fine particles might be the ultimate solution here.

m-80's stay lit under water. It always more fun watching things explode!

[jenglish]

Originally Posted by bucket brigade

I've decided NOT to go the way of Muriatic Acid. I jsut talked to a Pool Supply Store. happened to talk to the owner of this store who also has a reef tank and he is afraid my LR I dip in the Muriatic Acid would lower my pH in my reeftank once the LR was put back in (even after rinsing it several time)

While pure acid is going to affect ph, after a rinse and dry, the acid is gone. It cannot soak into the rock, it is dissolving the rock. I'm not trying to say to dip or not to dip, but it won't effect ph. The same goes for bleach, but it won't dissolve rock or remove phosphates.

[bucket brigade]

jenglish.... i respect your opinion, just in this case i've opt'ed not to use the acid because ultimately i dont want to WEAKEN the structure of my rock. i agree that the acid would have no pH effect once thoroughly rinsed. i'm more worried that if i 'cooked' the rock in bubbling acid for 6 hours, i'd go to pick it up with yellow gloves on and it would break in half or a big chunk would crumble off in my hand. it all just sounds way toooo high risk for me because i like many of the nooks-n-crannies of alot of my larger rocks. many of my larger rocks i paid well over $50, if not closer to $100 for when they were beautifully purpled-up. not willing to end up with multiple 5gal buckets full of rumble rock.

UPDATE

Of the 4 mollies, only two still remain and they are both hiding in the upper corner of the tank. Their breathing seems fine, just seem scared to death to come out. They are not eating from what I can see (unless they come out at night & eat HA...but I doubt it)

Of the other 2, one I had to pull from the tank as I found it dead on the bottom this afternoon. The other is MIA. Probably either hiding among the LR or dead among the LR.

My guess is these mollies are gonna be a complete failure come Mon or Tues.

I'll report back.

I did go ahead & purchase a Lawnmower Blenny this afternoon. He is acclimated and now in the tank as my "backup plan" or "plan-b". He is currently jumping from rock to rock & picking at the rock but have yet to see him actually go after random clumps of GHA i have thru-out the tank. My guess is he'll probably just scrap slime and leave GHA to grow 12 feet long. dont you just love my attitude.

for those of you playing along with the home-game version of this thread.... yes, I have my baseball bat readily in hand & about to uncork about 6 months of freddie kruger frustration on this tank.

[aquawolf]

Sorry to hear that the mollies are not performing as you had hoped so far, and the lawnmower blenny is a trip as well. I have heard a lot of different opinions on if they will actually eat hair algae or not, I wonder if it comes down to an individual taste and preference.

I hope you can manage to hold off on the baseball bat for a little while longer, and let us know if any of the fish start eating it for you.

[bucket brigade]

UPDATE.....

turned OFF all the waterflow in my tank & dropped some flakefood right above their head in the corner of the tank. it took a couple of minutes but they started eating the flake.

in fact, as the flake started to fall towards the bottom they "loosened-up" and swam around the tank chasing down flake particles.

both my flame angel & my marine betta were right next to them checking out the food.... so i KNOW for a fact the mollies ARE NOT afraid of my other two fish.

after about 10mins I cranked my waterflow back up....and off to the upper corner the mollies went. almost immediately.

so... i'm pretty sure they are scared of all the waterflow churning around inside the tank.
so... it begs to question, ARE MOLLIES GOOD SWIMMERS IN WATER CURRENT?
maybe... they can't handle my sweeping water current (?)

my 75g is NOT sumped. everything i have is HOB. the tank is completely BB.
i've got a 350gph hob powerfilter,
a 150gph hob powerfilter,
a 400gph canister,
everything above with NO MEDIA, NO FILTRATION just there for waterflow.
i also have two (2) koralia4's on the bottom back corners of the tank
everything is pointed in one direction to create a complete counterclockwise flow inside my tank. its pretty impressive to watch all the waterflow SWEEPING from left to right across the front of my tank. from a topview you can see a counterclockwise SWIRL on the water surface.

my plan is to turn off the flow every 2nd day, LIGHTLY feed them, then turn back on until they final loosen-up & quit being so uptight about the waterflow. who knows if this will work. i would think eventually they'll loosen-up. my 2nd fear is that they'll get hooked on this flake & not eat any GHA. i guess only time will tell.

i'll report back as more develops.