Help convert w/d to refugium

Jeff_edge540 · 03-30-2006, 04:18 PM

I'm trying to figure out a way to convert my small wet/dry into a sump/refugium. I was thinking of not running any sand/mud substrate. Just rubble rock (due to the water upflow). I have tried to annotate a possible solution on the following photo.
The white lines are existing panels. The pink lines will be new panels. The blue arrows show water flow direction.

Will this work? Any suggestions?
Besides .125" plexi what other materials (glue?) do I need?

Also, I'm trying to work around the existing horizontal brackets (for holding the bio balls). Is there a way to remove those if needed?

110galreef · 03-30-2006, 06:42 PM

What flow are you moving through this and what is the distance between the white and pink baffles.

You may be moving way to much water through a little space.

Jeff_edge540 · 03-30-2006, 07:53 PM

The flow is off a Mag 7 (return). I would guess it is 500gph. The distance between the white and pink baffle is approx. .50" x 9".

I was using the baffles to maintain a constant water level in the middle and to cut down on the splashing from the output of the skimmer.

110galreef · 03-30-2006, 07:56 PM

You will probably want at least 1" between the two baffles. Also this may be two small of a fudge to do much of anything.

Why do you want one? What are your intentions for it? I am not a big fan of them, yet they have some purpose with that being said!

Jeff_edge540 · 03-30-2006, 08:55 PM

I plan on putting a light over it and growing algae in order to help with nitrates and phosphates (& possibly harboring critters).

BTW: It's not that I WANT a refugium, I wanted to take the bio-balls out of my wet/dry to cut down on possible nitrate production. This caused a lot of splashing and bubbles. So, my main goal is to get rid of the splashing and bubbles without replacing my sump and skimmer. Realizing that by raising the water level using these baffles will also potentially give me a place to grow algae.

Why do you not like them? Whats wrong w/ refugiums?

110galreef · 03-30-2006, 09:29 PM

For the extra work and little that they will help....not all that effective. Many will ellaborate on this more. Some will argue for and some against. But for the size of the one you'll be making I wouldn't worry about it. You can still put bafffles in if you want to reduce splashing...as that is a good idea. However, will the sump be able to hold the water in the event of a power outage now that the water level will be raised?

You may just want to look at putting as big of a skimmer into the now opn BIO BALL section vs. the refugium? A good skimer will help a lot as well w/ what you are trying to do.

Many just run a sump w/ baffles and a big skimmer! That is what I have now!

I had a wet/dry for a few years...thought about the refugium...now have sump w/ big skimmer, and lots of LR...That's it!

motorslave · 03-30-2006, 09:40 PM

I would put at least 1 1/2 between baffles. If the velocity of water through them is too fast, thewn bubbles will get taken along for the ride and make it back into the main tank. How much room do you have under there to clean on a regular basis? that will probably be the main issue with putting rock ar anything else in there. It will make it harder to clean. Sumps act as settling tank by nature, the more stuff in your way the more of a pain to clean and after a while youll either dotch the whole fuge idea or just slack off on maint. and youll have water quality issues even without the bio-balls. A fuge can serve a purpose, its best to set it up, if you want one, in a manner that is conducuve to esasy care of it. They need very low flow in order to be effective. It is basically a second tank to care for. I am actually on the fence about them but know they are more work and not always needed. There is alot of debate over them.
To remove the peices supporting the bio-ball tray, just use a dremmel. For adhesive you need something called Weldon. It is specifically for acrylic and comes in many thicknesses. I used #3 when I built my sump. Its about the consistancey of water maybe a touch thinner. It goes up to at least #16 (thick) You may be able to get away with silicone since its not a structural peice youre doing but i dont know how long it would stay bonded to acrylic and it wopuldnt do well with any force on the baffle. HTH

R

110galreef · 03-30-2006, 09:47 PM

I knew someone would elaborate a little more..

Oh yeah as for the baffles...you can get by w/ silicone or better yet use the all-glass silicone...holds great. I used it on glueing acrylic baffles to my glass sump and holds good!

Caoineag · 03-30-2006, 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff_edge540

I plan on putting a light over it and growing algae in order to help with nitrates and phosphates (& possibly harboring critters).

BTW: It's not that I WANT a refugium, I wanted to take the bio-balls out of my wet/dry to cut down on possible nitrate production. This caused a lot of splashing and bubbles. So, my main goal is to get rid of the splashing and bubbles without replacing my sump and skimmer. Realizing that by raising the water level using these baffles will also potentially give me a place to grow algae.

Why do you not like them? Whats wrong w/ refugiums?

That small a one won't actually help with nitrates and phosphates or at least not enough for you to notice. I have a refugium but its over half the size of my main tank and its for food production, pH stabilization, control area (what can I say, I like to watch live rock come alive, you can't do that as well with fishies) and other reasons.

If you want something to slow water down and add to the denitrification process put pieces of live rock down there. You would have to clean the detritus out every once and awhile but that would slow the water and possibly help more with your nitrates due to the bacteria.

Just a suggestion.

motorslave · 03-30-2006, 10:19 PM

The issue with the speed of the water isnt through the chamber, its how fast the water goes through the baffles. The closer the baffles the higher the velocity, actual speed is dictated by the return pump, the farther the baffles are from each other will slow the velocity. Same GPH just not try to squeeze it through a narrow spot. With the small chamber that the skimmer is in there will be potential for bubble issues, you may even consider taking the second proposed baffle on the right and putting it in series with the one on the left so there is an over under over sequence the water has to follow. But, I digress, that probably wouldnt be any better than your present idea. The skimmer is a pretty tight fit in that first chamber and makes me wonder how much dwell time the tank water is getting with it, kinda looks like the water is in and out leaving little time for it to get skimmed.

R

Jeff_edge540 · 03-30-2006, 11:54 PM

Thanks for your comments. The skimmer's pump is upside down right under the inlet elbow. It gets the water straight from the tank (for the most part). After going thru the skimmer it exits under the skimmer body and back into the same water for that chamber then spills over the side (there is a heigth adjustable spill wall to controll skimmate wetness). This is known as a wet/dry "pro" series from Sealife Systems (same as Pro Clear). The skimmer is incorporated in the w/d unit and cannot be run in another sump.

Jeff_edge540 · 03-30-2006, 11:58 PM

What do you think about moving the right pink baffle to the left a couple of inches. This way I could move the blue sponge into that chamber. This should help with bubble and gunk removal (never did like the current place of that sponge).

smeese · 03-31-2006, 03:30 AM

Really the only thing that size fuge will do is harbor critters (which is great) but for an effective fuge you should have on twice-3X the size of your display. I have a little one too for the pods and such. That is the way to go. Good luck Steve

110galreef · 03-31-2006, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smeese

Good luck Steve

Who is steve?

Or is this you....Meaning

Godd Luck!

Steve

110galreef · 03-31-2006, 08:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff_edge540

What do you think about moving the right pink baffle to the left a couple of inches. This way I could move the blue sponge into that chamber. This should help with bubble and gunk removal (never did like the current place of that sponge).

That could work...would do the same now but may be easier to access.