heater question

ouccmich · 02-04-2006, 05:30 PM

I have a question regarding heaters. I don't have a sump setup yet but will be getting one when I move up north in a year and a half (and upgrading tank size).

I had a friend recently lose everything due to heater overheating the water and boiling everything. How does anyone go about preventing that from happening? Is there a good heater out there than can protect from doing that or if not how often should I replace my heater to keep that from happening? My heater's 1 1/2 yrs old now at least. Just curious. Also, what heater is "the best?"

Phishnoob · 02-04-2006, 05:44 PM

I would get a good quality Titanium heater with a separate probe. I had a glass one go nuts and heat the tank, then trip off the power before.

Just in case the heat goes off I got one rated for a 200g tank for our 55g. The price difference is so small to get a heater rated for a lot higher gallonage.

They make inexpensive temp-alert dealies if you really want to feel secure that will set off an alarm.

110galreef · 02-04-2006, 06:21 PM

Best thing is a controller

Tasher80 · 02-05-2006, 01:30 AM

Get a temp controller. I like the dual stage controller so that I can control a fan to keep the tank cool and the other side to control the heater.
http://www.marinedepot.com/aquarium_...gic.asp?CartId=
Its nice because you can set your heater a few degrees of what you like and then set the controller to what you really want. If the heater fails the controller turns it off. If the controller fails the tank only goes a few degrees hotter.
There are plenty more advanced models or even less expensive models. Just look around I just found the first one and linked it.

Loverotties · 02-05-2006, 09:41 AM

I love my Won ANALOG (not digital(they had problems with them)) Titanium heater.It has a remote bulb so the temp will be what you wany right were you put it,and it's very accurate! + or - .3 Deg.

whatevva · 02-05-2006, 10:37 AM

I had 2 heaters in the sump. The water is getting so warm from the lights that I removed both heaters and I'll end up with a chiller.

Confucious say "Make sure you NEED heaters BEFORE you buy them"

Mike O'Brien · 02-05-2006, 10:47 AM

You can use several smaller heaters. Small enough that if one malfunctioned it would not be able to overheat the tank.

tdwyatt · 02-05-2006, 01:19 PM

I use a combination of what most of the posts have suggested so far, although I prefer the Ebo-Jager heaters over the Won items due to the history for the digital Won heaters (it was SUCH a good idea, but history makes me wary of the line). Use several heaters to get to the 4 watts per gallon rule-of-thumb, use a really good analog heater, esp if you have electronic lighting ballasts (EJ's for sure, Won's analogs maybe, they still have to prove their worth to me) WITH A CONTROLLER OF SOME SORT. I have the Medusa controller for the systems here, a bit pricey, but dead on accurate and reliable, and will control a chiller if need be (I do not use chillers, I have fans plugged into the cooling side of the controller to blow directly on the surface of the sumps). I also have a few Ranco controllers as well, but I like the features for the Medusa better. If money is an issue, use the Ranco's, they are great!

Before using the controller, place your heaters in the water, allow them to come to temp equilibrium (about 2 hr.), then slowly dial them up to your preferred temperature so they all come on at about the same time, and the temp stays steady at your max temp while the lights for the system are OFF, allowing all the heating to be performed by the heaters rather than radiation gain from the lighting. Once the heaters are tuned in to the tank temp, then plug them into the controller and make sure the controller will heat the system to the same temp with the lights OFF. Once this is done, you'll have both sets of thermostats (the heaters' thermostats as well as the controller's thermostat) as redundant thermal safety sets for your system.

HTH

110galreef · 02-06-2006, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loverotties

I love my Won ANALOG (not digital(they had problems with them)) Titanium heater.It has a remote bulb so the temp will be what you wany right were you put it,and it's very accurate! + or - .3 Deg.

FWIW....I read many past post's on the WON's.....I decided to get one of the analog one's......it's stays on when my MH's are on????? There must be some sort of RF interference or what not. I have the IceCap Electronic balasts. ANy idea anyone. I have even tried to turn the thermostat all the way down and it still stays on w/ the MH.....as soon as I click them off....so to does the heater???

The MH's are plugged into a timer on a surge Power strip and the heater is plugged adjacent to the timer in the power strip as well. I may try moving some stuff however.

ChrisPrusha · 02-06-2006, 10:57 AM

That IS odd. I have never had trouble with my analog Won...but I don't have MHs. Is your tank roasting?

110galreef · 02-06-2006, 11:03 AM

Well fortunantly I have a chiller!

Latley I have just been unplugging it when I get in before the MH's come on and just plug it back in when I leave so it's not to bad.

I may tri wrapping it in Aluminum Foil, but I think it's in the wiring not the air.

tdwyatt · 02-06-2006, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 110galreef

...it's stays on when my MH's are on????? There must be some sort of RF interference or what not. I have the IceCap Electronic balasts. ANy idea anyone. I have even tried to turn the thermostat all the way down and it still stays on w/ the MH.....as soon as I click them off....so to does the heater???

The MH's are plugged into a timer on a surge Power strip and the heater is plugged adjacent to the timer in the power strip as well. I may try moving some stuff however.

You need to check first (I know this seems like it is directly associated with powering up the MH's, but...) to make sure that the temp is high enough in the water column to not continuously trigger the heater's thermostat within its range of operation. I do not know what the + # of degrees F are for the Wons, but if it is wide, and the water column is warm already, it may not cut off the thermostat completely unless the heater is unplugged for a moment, as the electronix for the heater may be such that there is a cutoff (powerdown) cycle. I do not know this for sure in the Won heaters, this is totally speculation, but it would account for this type of behavior in a thermostatically controlled device.

This was an issue with the old Digital heaters as well, I never saw what I would consider an adequate explanation of the issues associated with these heaters, but the main issue with THOSE seemed to be based on the digital heater's thermostat picking up some of the RF generated in the power line of the ICEcaps when plugged into the same outlet as the heater (here, the power strip would be the culprit). Try plugging them into different outlets, even better would be different circuit branches (on different breakers) if possible from that location. It seems that there are always issues with these Won heaters somewhere in their production history, regardless of whether they are electronic or analog-thermostat equipped. The electronic ones definitely had problems, I cannot tell you for sure about issues with the analog heaters.

I am assuming that you're NOT using X-10 modules...

Safest path to follow at this point would be to use the Ebo-jagers and a controller as outlined above, as that seems to have historically been the heater with the least issues and most reliability in thread and post history.

HTH

110galreef · 02-06-2006, 11:26 AM

I have treid unplugging it when continuosly on w ....plugged back in and still stuck on. I have tried to turn it down all the way about 15* and still stays on...???? I know the temp spread is not 15*

110galreef · 02-06-2006, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tdwyatt

I am assuming that you're NOT using X-10 modules...

No! Also are there any line filter I could plug into it. I am very limited w/ powere here and only have the one circuit for the office.

I may just have to get a controller.

Loverotties · 02-06-2006, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 110galreef

FWIW....I read many past post's on the WON's.....I decided to get one of the analog one's......it's stays on when my MH's are on????? There must be some sort of RF interference or what not. I have the IceCap Electronic balasts. ANy idea anyone. I have even tried to turn the thermostat all the way down and it still stays on w/ the MH.....as soon as I click them off....so to does the heater???

The MH's are plugged into a timer on a surge Power strip and the heater is plugged adjacent to the timer in the power strip as well. I may try moving some stuff however.

Is everything grounded?You can't put it on anougher circuit but how about a sperate powerstrip.