Good Idea? Bad Idea? Let me know.

ErinGoBragh · 03-08-2005, 10:44 AM

Yes, I am still fighting algae in my tank. I found a product called Algone, Just wondering if anyone has had any experience with it.

Here it is...

http://www.algone.com/algone_information.asp
Thanks

SeaDog · 03-08-2005, 10:54 AM

I'd be very leary of adding chemical cures to the tank. I had a lot of the dreaded algae and found reduced feeding and increased flow brought it under control. I still get the occasional bloom but it doesn't last long. Hope this helps

Steve

skeety · 03-08-2005, 10:58 AM

Erin,

Don't know about the product. But I do know you and I set up tanks at almost the same exact time.

And I'm right along side with you on this algae problem, so I don't think it's abnormal. Think we just have to be patient, and wait for the tank to reach an equalibrium. You got a clean-up crew, right? Mine is SLOWLY winning the fight against the green stuff. I could get more snails and what not in hopes of getting rid of the algae overnight...but I'm afraid, the next day, they'd have done such a good job, that most of them would starve after that. SO my theory is to just wait it out until they get up to speed.

My g/f complains all the time that the tank looks gross. The water's great, but the green/brown glass makes it look dingy. But I just keep tellin her she's gotta be patient.

Point is...not sure a quick fix is best for the long haul. But as you know, I'm just as new as you, and could be completely wrong...so wait for more educated opinions to follow!

ErinGoBragh · 03-08-2005, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeaDog

I'd be very leary of adding chemical cures to the tank. I had a lot of the dreaded algae and found reduced feeding and increased flow brought it under control. I still get the occasional bloom but it doesn't last long. Hope this helps

Steve

I agree with adding chemicals to the tank, However, I am going nuts trying to get this straightened out. I am actually only feeding every 3 days now, and when I do feed, I am only feeding the clown what he can eat in a few minutes without any hitting the ground. My lights are only on 4 hours a day, I am now using purchased ro-di water for water changes (20% weekly). 50% carbon changes are now weekly. This basically looks like a synthetic carbon for additional filtration in conjunction with the carbon. I guess my biggest concern is that IF I start using this product, I don't want to be forced to continue using it. (like an instant algae bloom as soon as I remove it from the filter.)

The crazy thing is that my other 75 is basically identical to this one, and there have been no problems at all. With this one needing so much attention, it has been pretty close to being neglected and it is crystal clear. I believe I am at least 2 weeks late on a water change, and everyone in it is fat and happy.

I am definetly not going to run out and buy this stuff without more research, one reason why I posted here. I know my lfs started using it in a couple of his clients tanks about a month and a half ago, and so far no problems. but I would like to wait and talk to him in a few more weeks and see how it is doing in their tanks before I make any decision.

ErinGoBragh · 03-08-2005, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skeety

Erin,

You got a clean-up crew, right? Mine is SLOWLY winning the fight against the green stuff. I could get more snails and what not in hopes of getting rid of the algae overnight...but I'm afraid, the next day, they'd have done such a good job, that most of them would starve after that. SO my theory is to just wait it out until they get up to speed.

My g/f complains all the time that the tank looks gross. The water's great, but the green/brown glass makes it look dingy. But I just keep tellin her she's gotta be patient.

Nope, no clean up crew, I am still under orders not to add new tank inhabitants. My tank seems to be the opposite of yours, I keep the glass pretty clean, but the water looks horrible. I am being patient, and not rushing out to buy this stuff, I just am looking for more info at this point.

I know the water will eventually clear up, I Just hope it happens before I let my wife plant an expensive herb garden in it and go down to just 2 tanks (my other sw, and my fw with the cichlid from he_ _!)

rockster2599 · 03-08-2005, 11:38 AM

Here we go again

.
Did you buy your rocks? What are your test parameters?
Your tank is very young, you are trying to starve your algae of nutrients, even with perfect filtration and no feeding this will take weeks.
Imagine if you will that your algae is a man, you put him in a room and starve him (still giving him water). it will still take a couple of weeks before he dies. Algae compared to a man is tough as nails, it will therefore take weeks (maybe months) for you to starve it of nutrients.
The only thing you can do is keep up the water changes and BE PATIENT. You have made some beginners mistakes, quick fix products are only temporary solutions and waste your money.
Rockster

ErinGoBragh · 03-08-2005, 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockster2599

Here we go again

.
Did you buy your rocks? What are your test parameters?
Your tank is very young, you are trying to starve your algae of nutrients, even with perfect filtration and no feeding this will take weeks.
Imagine if you will that your algae is a man, you put him in a room and starve him (still giving him water). it will still take a couple of weeks before he dies. Algae compared to a man is tough as nails, it will therefore take weeks (maybe months) for you to starve it of nutrients.
The only thing you can do is keep up the water changes and BE PATIENT. You have made some beginners mistakes, quick fix products are only temporary solutions and waste your money.
Rockster

I have not bought the rock yet, I was told that it probably would not help because all of my water tests are just about perfect, and It would be possible to "strip" the ability of the rock to filter by adding it now. So far the response has been a resounding no, so unless someone chimes in with some really good positive info on it, it will remain on the shelf.
Thanks for the input.

motorslave · 03-08-2005, 12:00 PM

No clean up crew? Okay, Im not familiar with your set up. How old, whats in it, how long on the lights etc...? whats the details? Lets see if we can find the source of the problem so you dont have to buy/add chemical band aids. I went through a nasty hair algae crop after about 6 months. Working on the source was the key.
So lets see the details of the tank!

Robert

ErinGoBragh · 03-08-2005, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by motorslave

No clean up crew? Okay, Im not familiar with your set up. How old, whats in it, how long on the lights etc...? whats the details? Lets see if we can find the source of the problem so you dont have to buy/add chemical band aids. I went through a nasty hair algae crop after about 6 months. Working on the source was the key.
So lets see the details of the tank!

Robert

You can check here... http://thereeftank.com/forums/showth...3&page=2&pp=20

It is almost 5 months old now and most of the tank stats are below

Thanks

traip93 · 03-08-2005, 12:11 PM

Algae is all part of the growing pains, all new tanks go through it.

Wait it out and like what was said before, increase flow and cut back on feedings...or atleast be more carefull about what enters the tank actually gets eaten

ErinGoBragh · 03-08-2005, 12:20 PM

I probably should make myself a little more clear, I am not looking for a band aid fix. I am looking into anything and everything to remedy problem, and implementing the good solutions and trying to weed out the quick fixes. My redneck skimmer is working for now, but it is temp and will be replaced soon. I do plan on getting 100 lbs of LR, but that can wait since Ammonia, nitrates, and nitrites all read 0. My PH has been a little goofy, but I believe that is to be expected with all the algae in the tank. That being said, I do appreciate the input.

motorslave · 03-08-2005, 12:29 PM

Hmmmm. I cleaner up crew would do nicely to help control the algae. Most of my problem was the detritus had built up in my rock ( I got lazy for a while) so I took it out and cleaned it in old water when I did a water dhange. I also added to my snail and crab collection and adjusted my lights. Is there a spot or spots where the algae is the strongest/thickest or fastest growing? this would be a good indicator of where most of the nutrients are. Sounds like you feed smartly but anything left behind will add up quickly with out a good clean up crew to go after it and yoiu dont have much rock to filter the water. I wonder if adding your LR would help in getting things balanced out along with cleaners. The rock will give home to more bacteria.

Robert

skeety · 03-08-2005, 12:34 PM

Erin,

I read the post you referenced, and remembered being confused at that time as well. I'm sure you're right, but just as a reminder, WHO gave you strict orders not to get a clean-up crew...and WHY?

Might give some context.

As for your original question about the Algae ridding chemical...I'm gathering most on here don't recommend it, since most are trying to get to your root cause.

ErinGoBragh · 03-08-2005, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skeety

Erin,

I read the post you referenced, and remembered being confused at that time as well. I'm sure you're right, but just as a reminder, WHO gave you strict orders not to get a clean-up crew...and WHY?

Might give some context.

As for your original question about the Algae ridding chemical...I'm gathering most on here don't recommend it, since most are trying to get to your root cause.

Geoff is the one that put me on livestock restriction. probably because I want my tank to look like it has been around a while and buy things I shouldn't. It does look like this one goes into the "bad idea" file.

Quote:

Hmmmm. I cleaner up crew would do nicely to help control the algae. Most of my problem was the detritus had built up in my rock ( I got lazy for a while) so I took it out and cleaned it in old water when I did a water dhange. I also added to my snail and crab collection and adjusted my lights. Is there a spot or spots where the algae is the strongest/thickest or fastest growing? this would be a good indicator of where most of the nutrients are. Sounds like you feed smartly but anything left behind will add up quickly with out a good clean up crew to go after it and yoiu dont have much rock to filter the water. I wonder if adding your LR would help in getting things balanced out along with cleaners. The rock will give home to more bacteria.

Robert

I am unfortunatly down to 1 large cleaner shrimp and 3 snails for clean up critters. The algae is pretty much uniformly distributed. This is one reason why I haven't added more lr---

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErinGoBragh
Lots of reefers on this coast maybe, but I live far from any major city. I have been keeping an eye out for used equipment, even found some stuff on the classifieds on this site, but I haven't gotten any replies yet. I don't already have a RO-DI purifier, Unfortunately I have been forced to use our 1 gallon Brita purifier (does this do any good?)

The Brita is better than nothing, but really insufficient for what you need. A skimmer and some form of RO/DI filtration system for all the water you add to the system will drop the inputs of dissolved substances like phosphates (and added water system sources like polyphosphate that don't show up on hobbyist's test kits.) Remember that any dissolved solids that go into the tank, stay in the tank, so using good source water for you ASW and top off is a "MUST DO" item on your list of priorities. I agree that getting good live rock is up there, but until you control inputs and maximize your outputs for phosphates, there is not any real necessity to get more rock unless your having issues with ammonia and nitrite. If the fish are dropping and ammonia is present, then you definitely need more rock. Until then, get the green water under control by limiting your nutrient inputs first, and maximizing your exports by adding a good quality skimmer. If you have savings, now is the time to employ them before whatever dissolved organics in your water column decompose and begin to saturate the rock with decompositional products (yes, if input is high and export is low, you can outstrip the ability of rock to denitrify nitrates.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErinGoBragh
I have been getting some advice telling me to just go and buy all the live rock for the system, and that will clear it up, but I really don't want to put hundreds of dollars into a tank that is in this bad of shape. Is this the wrong mindset? should I just get the liverock now and hope that the tank doesn't get any worse?

Again, problems with ammonia mineralization would require more rock, and the bacteria that are in the rock will help your sand gain a biofilm coating so it will settle out in relatively new systems, but this will not help control the nitrate production in new tanks (although it does contribute to this in large pieces with anaerobic zones.) You biggest problem now is finding some way to limit the input of the real limiting nutrient of algal growth in marine systems: phosphate. Very important that you limit sources and remove DOC and the like from the water column (via skimming and water changes and biomass export) before they decompose and add to the nutrient load in the water column (where they can be quickly assimilated into substrates, leading to potential saturation of the substrate and a potential leaching source.)

I don't necessarily disagree with the concept of more biofiltration, just that it is not your highest priority unless you're loosing specimens to ammonia toxicity.

hth

Tom <"))))>(
(TDWyatt)
Wise men speak because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something. -Plato

motorslave · 03-08-2005, 01:00 PM

Gotta find whats feeding the algae. How deep is the sand? I would think that after such a short time that there wouldnt be much in the sand but then again there isnt much of a crew to help control wht does get into the sand. Maybe more flow is needed to help keep stuff in suspension so the skimmer can get it out.
I do think adding some snails and crabs would be a good idea to help get it under control. But still need to figure out where the algae is getting nutrients. I am also not so sure that getting some rock in there to get a bit more of a balanced system going wouldnt be such a bad idea. Hopefully some more seasones vets will chime in soon.

Robert