Frag room questions....

Theo A · 09-14-2007, 04:44 PM

I'm finishing out a 19' x 10' room in the basement for use as a frag grow out room. The ceiling is 8' high to the trusses. Slab base. 2 of the walls in this room are poured/formed concrete, the outside wall and the othe short wall(w/door) are 2x6's.

Currently I plan on running 4 50 gallon tubs (4'x3'x1') w/100g sump.

I'm planning on using a window AC unit to cool the room (not enough time or money to currently finish the entire basement (1800sq ft).

Questions:

Do I need to paint/epoxy the inside of the wooden walls?

How do I seal the wall to the floor? I'm assuming I don't want the sheetrock to touch the floor at all. Do I use a bead of silicone?

What should I use on the floor, epoxy paint or vinyl?

Do I paint the walls with a 2 part epoxy, similar to what you would use on a floor perhaps?

Will a 140 CFM exhaust fan be enough to keep the humidity down?

I'm most concerned about moisture. I don't want to ruin my brand new house.

Hop · 09-14-2007, 06:23 PM

Let me give you some advice from my experience.
1. Vent, both intake and exhaust, make the room seperate from the house by doing this.

2. Paint really doesn't work. I used aquatile in my wetroom and my buddy used marine epoxy with good results.

3. I used silicone on every joint, every screw and across the joint between the wall and floor.

4. If you can, I would just seal the floor with the new garage sealants with grit and flake design. I used waterseal and then cheap vinyl tile as it was 1/4 the cost of the floor treatment.

5. The vent fan may be enough, but in Florida, I doubt it. I have 20% humidity outside running 100cfm in a room 1/3 the size and I had mold right behind the tanks and sumps. Humidity in the wetroom hit 80% at times. Plus walking into the room, you could feel the humidity.

6. I would be too. I only had 450 gallons of water with the display and wetroom vented seperate from the house and after 2 years of running, it cost me about 3k and a bunch of manual labor to fix the damage from the humidity. But you won't have nights below 20 degrees(I hope) where water is cascading off the windows of your home due to the humidity

Good luck!

Theo A · 09-14-2007, 08:25 PM

I should update my profile, I'm in ATL GA. The humidity isn't quite as bad here, but it can get somewhat high at times. It's hotter here though with no ocean breeze.

Where was the damage in the house if I might ask?

Where did you tile?

What would you have done differently to prevent the damage?

Hop · 09-14-2007, 08:31 PM

The damage was at the window sills, the sofet in the ceiling in my daughters room and the drywall and insulation in the wetroom.

I used aquatile, which is like 4X8 sheets of fiberglass used in bathrooms, but cheaper. It comes with a cost as you have to seal all the joints.

What I would do differently, I already am

Although condensed, since I had to downgrade due to a few issues, here is my thread...
http://thereeftank.com/forums/showthread.php?t=104067

Although not finished, I think you will get the idea

Theo A · 09-14-2007, 09:06 PM

Hmm... Well, here is a re-evaluation of the situation:

Seal up the walls to the floor with silicone to prevent moisture from going behind the drywall.

Paint the walls with epoxy (if cost feasible)

Install 2 commercial exhaust fans at 150cfm each, controlled by a humidity switch

Set up a dehumidifyer (we have a good one we bought after a hurricane- DUH I forgot)

I'm curious about the wall panels. How do they seal up against the drywall? I'm assuming I would still need drywall to mount those too.. ? (I couldn't just mount them straight to the studs?)

Hop · 09-14-2007, 09:10 PM

My drywall even though it was the great green board, got soft and pastie from the humidity. I used water-resistant adhesive to secure them to the wall. The ceiling needed some screws to hold it while the compound cured.

Many people do it with drywall alone, but I just couldn't risk it again. My family had sick issues for a year before I noted the mold growing in my daughters room.

Theo A · 09-14-2007, 09:23 PM

Where did you find the glass shower surrounds? Cost?

I don't want to think about my hobby getting my family sick, I can imagine how you feel/felt.

Did you just silicone those glass sheet together I assume?

Hop · 09-14-2007, 09:40 PM

Yup. they sell them at lowes for about 8-12 bucks for a 4X8 sheet I believe. that's why I went with them over the fiberglass that were 20 something. They have an acrylic coating and work just fine

Theo A · 09-14-2007, 09:51 PM

Shoot, if I was going to put those on (which it looks like a good idea), I won't even have to pay someone big $$ to come mud my drywall together. Looks like a good idea to keep the moisture away from anything it can grow on.

Maybe overlap each joint 2-3 inches with some silicone inbetween. I think between this, the dual fans and the dehumidifier, I might be ok

Hop · 09-14-2007, 11:23 PM

Sorry, I ate dinner and the thread got buried

I just butted them up leaving about 1/4" between the panels and then used caulk to fill the seams. I used a flexible caulk and the bright white color didn't stay as you can see in the pics, but it still looks OK. Function before fashion on this one

Theo A · 09-15-2007, 08:35 PM

I just found a 750 CFM in-line blower for $175, rated for commercial/continuous duty. I'll be installing 2 6" ducts that T into a 8" and then an 8" discharge. I think that ought to be good enough to evac the room during the really cold days. I'll also be running a dehumidifier as well. I plan on using a rheostat to vary the speed of the blower, unless I can find an automatic controller that will do that for me (which would be sweet!) The window A/C will of course take care of the temp on the hot days (I do live in HOT-Lanta)

I think with that kind of setup, I should be sitting pretty with the humidity issues....

Tasher80 · 09-16-2007, 10:02 PM

You could use one of these
http://www.plantlightinghydroponics....rol-p-361.html

Theo A · 09-17-2007, 10:47 AM

If anyone is still reading this

Should I use green-board for the walls with the shower surrounds (like Hop), or should I use hardibacker cement board w/shower surround (or just trowel over it)?

tdwyatt · 09-17-2007, 11:30 AM

Greenboard is what I used and epoxy waterproof paint. GET A DEHUMIDIIER and plumb the discharge to the outdoors (to a garden) or to an outdoor drain tile or your home sewer. With the fans, you'll exhaust a good bit of the humidity that might collect in the house from the tanks, and with the dehumidifier, the room will not collect any moisture from the outdoors (during the summer or when outdoor humidity is high) as condensation. I have my wetroom and study fixed with this, no problems after 4 hears so far, even inside the walls. I used the composite shoe molding and left a 1/2 inch gap between the bottom of the greenboard and the floor, but caulked a paintable silicone bath and tile caulk at the quarter round on top of the shoe mold to prevent water leaks from seeping to the base plate of the wall. I can fill up the wetroom behind the 180 display to 3/4" deep at the threshold with ro/di (another story

) and it will not wet the wall behind the greeboard nor the carpet in the study.

BTW, Hardibacker is about 2'x5' and is around $11/sheet, kinda pricy, but it will be the best for your wall if you tile over it, as although it is moldproof, it is by itself not very impermeable to water and requires special treatments to be truly effective at stoopping water by itself... See their site for a ton of info that will help you make a good decision on the topic.

Also, as you're doing the wallwork, have your electrician install a breakerbox just for the wetroom with a swith to change your electrical source from mains to a generator while you have the framing open for installation. This will make it easy down the road to install a dedicated generator for the tanks, and allow for ARC-fult breaker instll now. One breaker branch for the lighting, one for the pumps, and one for all the other accessories. Might as well install a supply line for the water for cleaning and for the RO/DI, a little sink to clean the skimmers in (a laundry sink), and to drain away your waste water should you so desire.

HTH

Twitterbait · 09-17-2007, 03:46 PM

I have a few more things to consider. after you have the walls framed in and before you put up your green board (i would use the concrete backer board) line all the walls with plastic sheeting to kee moisture out of the walls. I would also consider running the power through water proof conduit to protect it.

in the end your best bet to protect everything would be to build a cover for all the tanks and sumps. even clear plastic sheeting on a wood frame. if you keep evaporation down you will totally reduce the risk of mold and condensation. plus you will save a ton of $$$ on evap top off.