Foam Insulation Rock Experiment, Take One

[icebear]

Ok, since the coconut shells weren't gonna work, and many cringed at my PVC pipe w/ rocks stuck all over them musings, and since i don't have the time to water cure (or vinegar cure) aragocrete rocks, i decided to look into the Foam stuff that Tyler had mentioned breifly. Found out what brand and the method used. Found out about another substance that was used for sealing concrete in outdoor goldfish/koi ponds that is supposed to be 'reefsafe'.... I asked a question about the foam and my ideas at another forum, waited many hours, go zero suggestions (this happens over there, its like going to Walmart and expecting good, knowlegable service~ just cause its big dosen't mean its better) but i digress.... i decided to go it on my own.
With my remaining $25 i went to Home Cheapo and got one can of "Great Stuff" insulating foam ($5.79) and one can of DryLoc masonry Waterproofer, latex base ($17.86) in white since the foam is a cheerful sunny yellow and says it needs to be painted- and it can be painted with latex and i thought white was a good color for pretend LR to start with.

My thoughts were to haul out a couple leftover bags of precious southdown sand and pour them into some big rubbermaid totes, get it somewhat moist so i could shape the sand into rocklike molds and then squirt the foam in aragocrete style, throw some marble pebbles in for weight then pour more sand on it to coat it and add texture to the foam before it dries.

So thats what i did.

It gets solid pretty fast- dried enough so i could haul my shapes out of the sand about an hour later... i'm pretty pleased with the results so far.

I'll need another can of that foam to play around some more.

My next step in the experiment is to brush off the loose sand and then see if i can paint the shapes with the latex watersealer....i hope to seal the foam off completely if possible and i would like to think it will not be an issue later if i am unsuccessful... i'm hoping the sealer won't peel off this stuff.....I think its worth a shot since the can stated that the foam could and should be painted- and latex could be used and the latex based masonry sealer claims to be usable on porous surfaces in underwater aplications and claims to be quite rugged.


I'll post some pics later if i don't get laughed at first.

[icebear]

ok, since the board is silent either laughing with hands clamped over mouths, or politely refraining from telling me bad news....

the cave looks a bit....unnatural (as if the yellow foam dosen't) but once painted and with stuff growing on it- do you think they will work?

i'll attempt to post a pic of my rocks:

[Mafiaman]

Man I realy think you have a HIT!

Got me thinking a combo pack of live rock/great stuff!!

[cyberchef]

I just have one question??????



How are you going to keep the rock from floating?

[icebear]

Originally posted by cyberchef
I just have one question??????



How are you going to keep the rock from floating?

i stuck smallish rocks all through them for weight as i was building up the shapes....(at the two bases of the cave there is a good 2 handfulls at the bottom of each and more dropped in throughout)

i don't know if i should have put more in than i did, but this was just the first test run... if they float i will either try again or somehow anchor the foam to something that will keep it down....

i'll have to do a float check before i go any further... they seem pretty weighty as they are....but they aren't finished curing, so they may get a teeny bit lighter, then much of the sand will brush off......

[Mafiaman]

He has marbels pebbles in it.

You know before you paint you could drill and cut holes of all sizes to make it like coral or lime stone live rock.
Giving more surface area for corline algae and hiding spots for the critters!

[icebear]

Yeah, i was thinking i could do some carving

[Rick O]

I think it looks nice. But if you seal all of the pores up aren't you reducing it's ability to harbour denitrifying bacteria? That and what Don said.

[icebear]

Originally posted by Mafiaman
He has marbels pebbles in it.

You know before you paint you could drill and cut holes of all sizes to make it like coral or lime stone live rock.
Giving more surface area for corline algae and hiding spots for the critters!

i was thinking of dropping in ice cubes (which would melt and leave holes without needing to pry anything out of the dried 'rocks') or pasta shapes that could be soaked and scrubbed off after curing- their shell-like imprints would look sealife-y..... but i wasn't too sure about getting that sealing paint in all those nooks and i wasn't sure how well the sand would work out, i decided to start as simple as i could, a few random shapes and an attempt at more complex sculpture....

[icebear]

Originally posted by Rick O
I think it looks nice. But if you seal all of the pores up aren't you reducing it's ability to harbour denitrifying bacteria? That and what Don said.

well the instructions on the can said that it "should be painted to prevent sun damage" so, i wasn't sure if i should let it in the tank as-is...the board i got the original info from, the person who used the foam in his tank didn't see any breakdown (without any treatment, just yellow- saw coralline developing) and i guess they use it in europe all the time for aquascaping....

i bought the sealer just in case i need it.....


i'd like it to function as true LR, but i don't want it falling apart in the tank either....
thats the part i'll haev to monitor... i think i'll paint one piece and not paint another and just watch what happens.....


but then the color- that yellow MUST be covered up

[Lostmind]

wow, very interesting idea.

[gregt]

Did you guys see this one? http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-08/nftt/index.htm

[icebear]

yep, thats the guy who's thread i got my info from

i just decided to try a step further and make freeform rocks....

[gregt]

Ok, just making sure.

[icebear]

it was a very helpful article, everyone should read it before you all think i've gone nuts....

i just didn't want to start posting links to that other board if it isn't ok to do.

specially where i was a bit miffed that nobody tried to answer my questions over there


This is what i had posted there--

Making 'rock' out of expanding foam, looking for options...


I did a search on making rocks and backgrounds with foam, and unless i missed the discussion on this in particular, i didn't see anyone mention these things:

Spraying out the foam into basic shapes and mashing dried shell-shaped pasta into it to give it a oceanic form...

Carving it when dry into shapes

How to weigh it down if its used as free-form pieces- not anchored to the side of an aquarium...

Using well-oiled (cooking oil) aluminum foil to 'mold' the foam into shape- and if the oil can be removed from the foam for tank use (vinegar?) or if the foam reacts to it in a bad way....


Objects that can be used to make large-ish caverns but don't need to be removed before use- like large icecubes pressed into the foam that will melt away leaving a divet- if you used wood or something, it would be a permanent chunk of something embedded into the foam...


How creative have you all tried to get with this stuff and how well did your attemps turn out?

I don't think i saw where the density of this stuff was mentioned. Does it cure really hard or does it have a crispy 'give' to it?

I LOVE this hobby, but it is really expensive for me, and my local fish stores have aiptaisia ridden tanks and i am petrified of getting them, i have absolutely no aips in my tank right now and want to keep it that way, so i'm looking into creative alternatives for rock just to decorate my tanks and to fill in empty spaces.
i enjoy crafting and stuff, so i don't mind playing around a bit with different ideas before i decide to just buy some cheap LR or dry base rock.

Anyone care to give me some ideas and tell me if any of this might work?