Clarkii - rapid breathing, still looks good

bradneal · 11-11-2003, 08:59 AM

I'm pretty new to reef, as a matter of fact, 6 weeks ago, I didn't know a clown fish from a cleaner shrimp (if your interested, here's my story: http://www.thereeftank.com/forums/sh...threadid=26077), and today I have a fully stocked 55 gal reef.

Anyway, last week I noticed my Clarkii seemed to be breathing rapidly, acting a little erratic, and swimming in place against the current. His color is still good, although his nose is looking a little pale. His fins and gills all look good as well.

I fear he's coming down with something, and with my inexperience, I don't know what all to look for. I did a search on this forum, but all "rapid breathing" threads I came across seemed to include white specks or infected gills.

Any thoughts?

Thanks,
Brad

Filters are 2- H.O.T. Magnum canisters and a protein skimmer.
55 gal All Glass
No sump

3 cleaner shrimp
Several crabs in shells ranging from 1/2" to 1 1/4 " in diameter
5 snails
1- Clarkii clown
2-Maroon clowns
1-Green Mandarin
Sea Anemone
Various mushrooms and coral

tkjeffrey · 11-11-2003, 09:12 AM

IMO you have too new a tank for a mandarin and anemone, but anyways I have two clarkii and they breathed rapidly when I first got them, they were mail order and they were severely stressed when I got them. But!! I think those clowns are the toughest fish I have ever seen, both of them looked like they were knockin on heavans door but with water changes (twice weekly 5 gallons each time, I have a 55 also) and keeping them fed real good they pulled through and are now very happy fish. Also I would use your canister filters sparingly due to them being nitrate factories if not kept spotless. All I have on my 55 is skimmer 85 pounds of LR and hang on refugium with macroalgae to control nitrates and I have very healthy tank (6 months old).

tkjeffrey · 11-11-2003, 09:13 AM

Oh and 8 gallon water changes weekly

salt creepette · 11-11-2003, 09:21 AM

tk jeffrey covered it pretty well. I had the same problem you are having with my pair of perculas (see my post entitled 'amyloodinium, brooklynella, marine velvet?' or something like that). After much posting and agonizing, I ended up keeping the remaining clown (the male died) in a 10g hospital with no substrate, immaculate water quality (water changes of about 2 gallons every other day) and feeding her really well. She pulled through and is now fine. Come to find out, my mother in law, who I got her two clowns from the same source and day, turned up with the same problem as well, and she is also doing more frequent water changes, and hers are doing ok also. hope this helps.

bradneal · 11-11-2003, 09:22 AM

TK,
Thanks for the response. Although I have only had the setup for a month, It was a well established (4years old) reef that we moved. It belonged to a close friend that passed away and his wife asked me to take it.

Thanks for the tip on filters. I have noticed that my nitrates are running high and I couldn't figure out why, as all other levels are normal.

-Brad

salt creepette · 11-11-2003, 09:23 AM

i forgot to say that I did freshwater dip her a couple times when she looked the worst (white film on her fins and body) and that helped. you may or may not want to do that as well, your call...and I also vacummed the bottom of the tank during water changes to vacuum up any parasites that may have fallen off and were lurking in cyst form.

bradneal · 11-11-2003, 09:41 AM

Since there are no physical signs other than the breathing and behavior, should I just do frequent water changes and observe unless things worsen? I just did a 15% water change on Saturday. Maybe I should do another?

Also, should I remove one of those Magnum filters? Will that help lower the nitrates?

Thanks so much for the help.

-Brad

tkjeffrey · 11-11-2003, 04:19 PM

i would clean out your canisters and stick some carbon in one, and leave the other one turned off. try running your skimmer wet awhile that might help too, and yes water change would never hurt. I would do 5 gallons a week, but just my opinion.

Toadfish · 11-11-2003, 04:32 PM

Heavy breathing and swimming into current are two signs that your fish is struggling to get air. These are typically the first signs of oodinium. It attacks the gills first so you may never see the spots. Watch him very closely, if it is oodinium then you may not be able to save this fish, but there could be hope for the others.

bradneal · 11-11-2003, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Toadfish
Heavy breathing and swimming into current are two signs that your fish is struggling to get air. These are typically the first signs of oodinium. It attacks the gills first so you may never see the spots. Watch him very closely, if it is oodinium then you may not be able to save this fish, but there could be hope for the others.

Uhhhhhh... their may be hope for the others? Dude, that's not very reassuring. Is there something I should be doing to head this off? Is there a way to diagnose before it's too late?

-Brad

bradneal · 11-11-2003, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tkjeffrey
i would clean out your canisters and stick some carbon in one, and leave the other one turned off. try running your skimmer wet awhile that might help too, and yes water change would never hurt. I would do 5 gallons a week, but just my opinion.

I am running carbon in both canisters. One was cleaned and reloaded about 2 weeks ago, the other 4 weeks ago. I'll pull one offline. And when you say run the skimmer wet, do you mean reduce the amount of air to the intake? Sorry, I'm pretty new to a lot of this stuff.

-Brad

tkjeffrey · 11-11-2003, 09:21 PM

maybe when the move happened, the tank went thru a mini cycle or something, running the skimmer wet means adjust it so the foam looks wet rather than a dry foam, takes more out of the water (nutrients, and such) I dont run mine wet but some people do, you might want to try it for a week maybe and then reduce it to go back to dry foam, merely a suggestion, might not help at all

On a positive note....my two clownfish were looking absolutely terrible (scaly white looking skin, getting skinny, rapid breathing, etc) I didnt treat the fish or the tank since I didnt have a hospital tank and was a real newbie

I just started changing the water alot more and tried to stay away from tank as much as possible too not stress them out. Get yourself test kits for the water then alot of this will not be guess work anymore. I am fairly new to the hobby but frequent water changes and carbon and good food turned mine around. This is my opinion and somebody else may say "Man that guy is WHACKED!!" but just trying to help

Toadfish · 11-12-2003, 01:17 AM

How is the fish? I didn't mean to freak you out...I just wanted you to know what to look for in a worse case situation. Stress alone can make your fish breath heavily.

bradneal · 11-12-2003, 08:55 AM

Travis and Toadfish,

Thanks again for taking time out to help me.

Travis. I'm still not quit sure what to do to make the foam look wet. Would that be more air or less?

As for a test kit. I have a FasTest Master Kit. Are they reputable, in your opinion?

Toadfish, the fish actually looks pretty good. And his condition has not seemed to have worsened over the course of a week. His color is still good, no white spots or anything, and he's still eating. But clearly there seems to be labored breathing and the constant swimming into the current or hiding behind the LR.

I'm sure the tank is stressed. I combined my friends 10g nano with his 30g into one 55. This Saturday will mark the 7th week since the move, so maybe things will begin to stabilize soon.

Although they are getting along fine now, when I combined the 2 tanks, I introduced a pair of maroon clowns with the clarkii. I was told they may or may not tolerate one another. But after an initial tiff, they settled down and seem to be fine. That may or may not have added to the stress level... who knows.

Anyway, thanks again. I'll keep you all informed as things unfold.

Well, now it's off to fight the red algae and string algae. **** this thing is a lot of work!

-Brad

tkjeffrey · 11-15-2003, 10:57 PM

If you have red algae or hair algae then you most probably have excess nutrients in the water. Do water changes and get yourself a good cleanup crew. Use RO/DI water, no TAP water!! I swear by that. I have a 55 and have 40 nasirrus sp? snails to stir sand and eat ditaoms and 5 cerite, 5 bumble bee, 20 astrea snails and have no algae problem whatsoever (after an initail bout with awesome proportions of hair algae). The slime algae might also be caused by poor circulation, check that out. I have swift current in all parts of the tank and it seemed to help. Hope all goes well, like i said those clarkii are tough bastads so I dont think you gotta worry a whole lot. As far as the skimmer run it so the foam coming into the collection cup looks wet not dry. Dont really know how to explain this further.