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Old 11-21-2004, 10:34 AM   #1
redwinger
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Temp


I just hooked up a closed loop system and now I can't get the temp lower than 80.8 degrees. The closed loop consists of a mag 9.5 pump run through a scwd to two outlets. I am assuming that the pump is causing the increase in temp. The tank is a 44 gallon with 2x65 pc. Any ideas, I know a chiller would help but I have no sump yet and don't plan on adding one for a while. Is it this normal for a pump to had this much heat to a system and is that temp allright? I had been keeping it at 78- 79 degrees. Thanks
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Old 11-21-2004, 10:40 AM   #2
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Perfectly normal....your water is being used to cool the pump since it is an internal pump...plus you are putting backpressure on it by running it through a SCWD..

You can lower it if you want by placing some fans blowing at the top of the tank...evaporation will go up though....

80.8 is fine with me...

Greg
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Old 11-21-2004, 10:43 AM   #3
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At what temp should I be alarmed? Thanks for the reply and your 450 is looking great.
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Old 11-21-2004, 10:45 AM   #4
David Grigor
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Like mentioned before external pumps that are air cooled will add the least amount of heat.....
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Old 11-21-2004, 10:48 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redwinger
At what temp should I be alarmed? Thanks for the reply and your 450 is looking great.
My normal temp is around 80-81...I start to get alarmed at 83.5+

Thanks for the compliment...

Greg
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Old 11-21-2004, 05:02 PM   #6
happy
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there are two types of heat input to worry about. a submerged pump adds both types, while a air cooled pump only adds pump heat. here is an article I found

---------------------------------------------------------------------

"The pump uses some amount of electrical energy. This energy must end up somewhere. A relatively small amount of it is dissipated as heat from the motor. The overwhelming majority of it is converted from electrical energy to mechanical energy in the form of a rotating shaft that does real work on the water.

This energy ends up in the water by increasing its temperature. It is called "pump heat" and can be very significant.

An Eheim 1048 is rated at 10 watts, almost all of which ends up in the water.

An interesting aside for non-believers: This is also why excessive use of a blender to mix up frozen orange juice results in the juice not being as cold as expected. Also, nuclear power plants use primarily pump heat (from three or four 6,000 HP pumps) to heat up almost 75,000 gallons of water from 200 degrees F to about 550 degrees in about six hours or less.

The point here is that there is a trade off in how big a pump to use to increase the flow rate. More flow is beneficial. It is best to achieve the desired flow with as small a pump as possible and flow paths with minimum flow resistance.







Bottom Line




If you increase flow rate with the same pump, your temperatures will trend in the direction of goodness. If you increase flow rate by going to a bigger pump, you will reach a trade off somewhere where the pump starts putting too much energy into the system and temperatures will start increasing.
------------------------------------------------------------------

And to prove this, I (Happy) started two 5 megawatt Reactor Coolant Pumps at the Prairie Island Nuclear Power Plant Unit 1 last night, and heated up about 1500 tons of steel and water 60 degrees on my shift. Someone else will heat the reactor up another 350 degrees today. These pumps draw 6000 amps at 4160 volts on startup, which is enough power draw to dim lights in nearby towns. And, the night before last, I placed the 570 Megawatt Unit 2 generator on line, and after doing that, I reduced Southeast Minnesota's typical outlet voltage from 123.8 volts down to 121.2 volts, nominal. Every day, I change the voltage that comes out of the socket down here, but the frequency is 99.999 percent of the time dead on 60 Hz. Heck, they even pay me to do this, which I then turn around, and toss the money into the bottomless pit known as my reef.
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Old 11-21-2004, 05:08 PM   #7
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By the way, you can just assume that the wattage rating of the pump is the same as a heater always on for that amount of watts for a sumbmerged pump, and some slightly smaller amount for an air cooled pump. How many watts is the mag 9.5, and are you running it submerged?
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