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Old 05-26-2005, 04:08 PM   #1
Jive Turkey
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Plumbing Improv. (Long)


I am planning on redo-ing the plumbing on my 120g Oceanic RR SPS setup, to try to get a little more flow thru the sprayrack under the rocks.

Right now, I have 2 homemade Dursos(1,3/4") in one of the overflows that feeds a Seq Dart, that then goes thru the sprayrack . The other OF has a stock durso for the sump and a return with a double-ended LocLine. The 1" and 3/4" Dursos aren't powering the Dart very well, and if I try to push them, I get cavitation and microbubbles from under the rocks. Not good...

As I was beginning to work on it last night, I was trying to siphon out the overflow for the Dart so I could redo the plumbing. I realized that somehow the inner wall/dam of the ReefReady overflow had become dislodged, and the main tank was lowering as I siphoned the overflow. Meanwhile the overflow water level matched the main tank level. For those unfamiliar with Oceanic RR, the outer shell has vents near the bottom, and the inner dam is what the water really tops off at.

Well, it looks like I'll be draining the tank to fix this problem. Maybe I can nab that **** Gorilla Crab while I'm at it.
Heres the plan, I am going to drain the tank, putting the corals in the 90g sump and 40g prop while I do this. I think I will make the sprayrack a little smaller while I'm at it, because I have trouble hiding it under the rocks.
Now, I can choose to repair the overflow, or remove it entirely. As of now, I plan on ditching the overflow and adding strainers to the 1 and 3/4" holes to act as a joined, submerged intake for the Seq Dart closed loop, so I can run it at full speed, which is 3000gph. This will surely beat the 1200gph I was getting from the 2 Dursos in the broken OF. A small, purple-primered eggcrate cage will be constructed to further protect the strainers and bulkheads from rockslides.

The other OF, with the sump drain and return, will now have 2 drains instead, and I'll add a Seaswirl as a return. I need more flow in the sump, right now I have to use 2 powerheads or else the sump and prop stagnate with only 600gph thru them.

***How does this sound? It's going to be alot of work basically just to get more flow under the rocks, but I think it'll be a great improvement. Please, offer some tips if you'd like. I have never heard of removing an overflow to utilize the holes as a submerged intake, but I don't see a problem. I already have a submerged intake for a AM3K closed loop, and its perfect.

I'm basically improvising, so if you see any flaws, please speak up.

Thanks, Joe
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Old 05-26-2005, 06:04 PM   #2
David Grigor
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Sorry, I have a real hard time putting the words into pictures in my head to figure out how you have it currently configured......



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Old 05-27-2005, 12:09 AM   #3
trodder
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ditto... It seems that what you are trying to do should work out all rightIF I understand you correctly. That said I can't think of anything to add or change. The only thing I don't really understand is the ditching the overflow part and adding stariners. I would assume you are putting the strainers up high in the tank then at the water level???? I guess I would keep the overflow box and T the holes under the tank to increase your drain size that way.



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Old 05-27-2005, 12:14 AM   #4
Graham
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Since the dislodged overflow is running the closed loop, you don't have to worry that the teeth are on the bottom of the intact overflow. I wouldn't bother trying to reattach the other, since it will increase the time that the tank is down (I assume you will use silicone, which will have to cure). I think your idea of using strainers is a good one, since you will definitely be able to move more water thru the loop and minimize "bubble-age". That's as long as the "underflow" will allow as much water to pass as you want to move. You might have to clean the strainers more often at the bottom of the tank, though - unless you put them up on a few inches of PVC...

I don't see much problem with the sump "stagnating" as long as you periodically clean it out. The return chamber of my sump stagnates and I get a nice bubbly clear slime buildup every few days which I just skim off with a couple dips of a bowl. The tradeoff of the stagnation allowing detritus to settle is a big positive for me, since I'd prefer it to accumulate there if it has to accumulate at all. I'm only running about 1000GPH through my sump (to approximate what the skimmer takes in). I think matching to the skimmer (or even a little less) is a good idea. Any more and you're moving more water through the sump than the skimmer can take in....assuming you want your skimmer to process as much of the water as possible. Also, with more flow thru the sump comes less detrital settling, which is a negative IMO.

I don't know how much you will gain from the 2 intakes on the drain - unless the single was draining slower than your return can pump. If you had to cut the return pump back so it wouldn't overpower the drain, then you will gain by adding another drain...and could possibly even add a larger pump if this is something you're after. Again, I'd try to match return pump output with skimmer pump output.

That's my take...



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Old 05-27-2005, 01:13 AM   #5
Jive Turkey
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***David - Heres how its configured now.
The left overflow has both the original 1" drain and the intended 3/4" return being utilized as a combined drain for the Sequence Dart, both with homemade Durso pipes. This water then flows thru the back pane near the bottom, for a three-pronged sprayrack that resembles a pitchfork, to raise the rocks up a bit in the middle of the pile.

The right overflow has the 1" drain for sump, and the sole 3/4" return.


***Thomas - I choose this because it allow more flow thru the two existing holes. Dursos in an overflow cannot match a submerged intake. Aesthetic is also part of my reasoning.

I will be adding strainers to the existing bulkheads in the overflow, with no riser.

I had the 2 drains combined, with a 1.5" "T" mounted vertically directly under the 1" drain hole, with 3/4-1.5" and 1"-1.5" reducers in it to accomodate the smaller drain pipes. The water form the 2 drains combines in a 1.5" "T" and falls thru 1.5" pipe until the pump, so there should be no bottleneck effect where the drains meet. Yet I could only have the pump at half speed or cavitation would occur.


***Graham - The outer overflow still has conventional teeth at the top, but it also has two rows of tiny vents to let water in from near the bottom. The inner overflow is solid and watertight and doesn't have these vents, and is at the same height as the bottom of the outer overflow's teeth. The inner wall is what became dislodged.

I agree with the silicone curing part, I don't want that.

I will keep the small riser idea in mind, and try it if I feel the strainers get clogged too fast. Thats good thinking.

With the stagnation, I have the same scum of the surface. I assumed not a good sign.
There isn't really any detritus in there, I have been running a 2 1000 Micron socks for a little
while instead of 1 to see how much gets past the first one. Not much.

As of now, there are 2 Sedra 3500s @ 350gph for the skimmers, and a 700gph return running at full speed to match it. But the Dolphin return pump has begun to shock me once in a while, so I'm upgrading to a 950ghp Mag pump. The one inch drain will accomodate the Mag pump pretty well, at 6-800gph, but I feel that a two-ended LocLine out of one overflow isn't very useful since its too close to the corals and two strong to point right at them. So I'm intending on a 3/4" Seaswirl instead, and I may as well get as much flow from I as I can, since my new Mag will match it's 950gph capacity. I need the second drain to do this, and a little extra water over the teeth of the remaining overflow will help make up for the lack of one, as far as surface skimming in concerned.

Joe
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Old 05-27-2005, 11:49 AM   #6
David Grigor
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If I remember correctly we drilled two holes near the top back corners of the tank for the closed loop output and one hole near the center back midways up for the intake of the closed loop. You loose me when you say your using one of the overflows for the closed loop as I thought the back center bulkhead was for the closed loop input.......What are you using the center mid-way up bulkhead for currently ?
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Old 05-27-2005, 02:57 PM   #7
Jive Turkey
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I have two closed loops on the tank, Dave.
What you mention is a true closed loop with an Ampmaster 3000 with a spa strainer on the middle bulkhead. Totally seperate from the Sequence Dart pulling water from the two overflow drains that pushes thru the sprayrack.
Remember, you drilled 4 holes in all. The three you mentioned, and another one 3" off the bottom for the sprayrack input.
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