Live Aquaria

redwinger · 01-01-2005, 09:58 PM

Just a FYI for anyone that is ordering from live aquaria. This is a past experience that I have had with them. I placed a order from them last week for myself and a buddie. I ordered a cleaner shrimp, some more snails, 3 more chromis, a royal gramma basslet, two tomato clowns, a black lined blenny, a clown goby, and a foxface lo. The order arrived on time as scheduled. I opened the box to find that the case was extremelly cold. I started a drip acclimation on the inverts and tested the water temp in the bag it was 54 degrees! I then began to float the bags for about 25-30 minutes then I noticed that a bunch of stuff was missing. The 2 clowns were missing the blenny and the clown goby were all missing. I checked my order confirmation to make sure that I did for sure order these and I did. I called live aquaria and informed them that almost half of the order was missing and that the chromis did not look so good and neither did the foxface and the basslet was dead. They said that the items not shipped were on backorder. I still proceded to acclimate them hoping that they were just comotose but I knew that this probally wasn't at all good when I tested the temp in one of the bags. Needless to say the basslet was dead, one of the chromis was dead the other two chromis looked like they were on their way out and the foxface did not seem to be doing to well after he was introduced. Needless to say when I placed the order I put in the notes that it gets to about 10 degrees where these are going to be shipped and to make sure they get extra heat packs in the box to compensate. Only one was in the box when it arrived. I called them to let them know about the dead chromis and the basslet and they refunded my money. I also went off on them for not letting me know before the order was processed that some items were not available. My buddy and I would have probally gotten something else. Usually their site will say coming soon if a item is not available. My main displeasure was in the transport of the fish when I clearly let them know about how cold it gets here. The foxface did not make it and the one chromis went MIA and the other chromis was found dead the next morning. I had a pretty good feeling that the foxface was not going to make it after hiding for a couple days and not taking any food and sure enought this morning I found him in the rock dead. Needless to say this is the last order that I will ever place with this company for the lack of concern for the livestock. I am assuming that the temp did them all in. The inverts all seem to be fine. All my water params are fine and my other fish are just fine.

reeftanktime · 01-01-2005, 10:38 PM

My recent order with Live Aquaria was a similar experience. The shipment actualy got delayed in houston an extra day. I would have to say that the water was cold in the bags and I was very concerned for the fate of my new fish. Most made it thru the cold temps. I will be ordering from LiveAquaria again, just not in the winter.

Fahz · 01-02-2005, 12:03 AM

Redwinger:

I hate to ask the question but were all these fish going into your 44 gallon which just finished cycling on Noverber 20th or the 75 gallon you just setup last week?

Fahz

tico mike · 01-02-2005, 12:10 AM

We had a recent order from Live Aquaria arrive with NO heat packs. You shouldn't have to tell them as this is how they make their living. When you tell them and they still don't...One thing you can say though; they stand behind their guarantee and don't leave you hanging. I had another order from Roe's come a week or two ago and you couldn't feel a temp difference between the bags and my tank. They put in two large heat packs that were still warm when I opened the box. I'll order from Live Aquaria again as well as I've had good experiences in the past but it seems to be a bit of a trend.

MyUnderWaterWorld · 01-02-2005, 01:22 AM

I have had very good experince with them. Items that are on backorder will be shipped to you asap at no extra cost. They take very good care of the livestock they send, and does a outstanding job on packaging. Liveaquaria has some of the best customer service available and is the only place online I would get my livestock. I would wait until spring or so before making any orders. Tempature would become almost as cold as the outside temp regardless of how much heatpack was put in there. MY 2cents

tico mike · 01-02-2005, 01:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyUnderWaterWorld

is the only place online I would get my livestock.

There are plenty of places that do a great job and none are exempt from a mistake. I agree the customer service is tough to beat but Temps were well below zero when I got my order from Roe's and the heat packs were warm and water temps were excellent. I think a big difference is the quality of the heat packs. The small ones don't last. The ones Roe's sent were the largest I've seen. I don't know that I will order from them again or not as I'm pretty much buying only unique corals that I can see (wysiwyg's), but if they have something nice I wouldn't hesitate.

redwinger · 01-02-2005, 02:04 AM

Fahz,

I knew that question would come up. Did lots of reading on switching tanks and have seen a couple people that would fill with water and the next day switch everything over from their old tank with no losses. I waited about 3days after the new tank was set up and everything was stable as fas as ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, alk, calc and ph. Then I made the switch over. All while monitoring params twice a day since, with no change in chemistry. I highly doubt that had anything to do with it. But am I wrong? I don't know as this is all new to me. My deduction is that the extremelly cold water that the fish were in is what caused the stress and unltimately the death of these creatures. Am I way off base or is this the old "another way to skin a cat" Where some say wait and some say don't? It seems that it is anybodys guess at times. As far as packaging I can't complain everything was double or triple bagged and the was sealed well. I am not upset at the fact that the items died. It happens, but some things could have been prevented on their end. They have been excellant as far as customer service on that end. My concern is for the livestock being shipped to colder temps with insufficent heat packs. I can't assume that 54 degrees is exactly healthy for tropical fish.

tico mike · 01-02-2005, 02:21 AM

You don't have to apologize for them not shipping better. However, adding all those fish at one time is crazy. I doubt anyone with an established tank would do that. However, I think in your case the fish were doomed before they got to your aquarium. It doesn't sound like they had enough time to foul your water. IMO that's more fish at one time than you should have in your tank when it's fully stocked. (I'm the type that has a few fish for interest sake but save the bio load for the corals.) The best thing to do when ordering is to get just a few fish and some hardy corals. When you're starting out like you are and want to order, get a few people together and just get a couple things. You'll be enjoying this hobby for a long time if you don't rush it too much. It seems like you've done a fair amount of research and have some knowledge which is good. However, I wonder if your actions and what you know to be the best way to do things are one in the same.

Sea monkey · 01-02-2005, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyUnderWaterWorld

I have had very good experince with them. Items that are on backorder will be shipped to you asap at no extra cost.

that is a amazing that they would eat the shipping costs like that .

on a side note i had a bad experience with www.marindepotlive.com i then changed and started useing http://www.reefermadness.us/ i have to say that i am way happier with reefer madness. the smaller shops appreciate your business way more and have the time to go out of their way to find you the best specimens.

I have to say that i am tempted by http://petsolutions.com prices at times though and thier shipping is super low at $25 ... although i think the old saying of you get what ya pay for is doubly true in this hobby .

Fahz · 01-02-2005, 11:11 AM

Redwinger:

Here's the point there is no way your tank can handle the bio-load your adding at one time. It's possible even if the fish had servived the may have been doomed.

As far as Live Aquaria and shipping fish in winter.There quality of livestock is the best I have seen and there shipping is very good. The problem with winter shipping is you should be picking up your shipment in the shippers offices at 8:30 AM when they arrive. If you are waiting for them at home they are riding around in a cold truck until they get to you. On cold days it doesn't take much for box temps to drop to low levels. Year round I always pickup my livestock with UPS or FedEx in office. I don't think Live Aquaria deserves all the blame here and a company that has a fourteen day arrive alive policy isn't shipping livestock that dies for the fun of it. I have received coral and livestock in winter from a lot of companys and heat packs are not all they are cracked up to be. Getting the package in your warm little hands ASAP is the answer and part of that response ability lies with you also. Just my .02 worth for what its worth.

Fahz

tico mike · 01-02-2005, 11:20 AM

Fahz makes a great point. You can add to your success by picking them up. Also, during the winter it helps to pay a bit more and buy from online places closer to home. Carolina, Ohio, Ill., anywhere like that and stuff isn't generally picked up for Fedex until like 7 pm. If you then do like Fahz says and pick up your order, winter shipping generally won't be a problem.

redwinger · 01-02-2005, 11:52 AM

wouldn't I see a spike if the bioload is too high. everything including trates have allways been at 0 with no flucuation? Picking up the order makes perfect sense.

tico mike · 01-02-2005, 02:46 PM

You'd see a spike but not right away. It doesn't happen over night. But when it does happen it's too late. That's why people add a little at a time.

FastFish720 · 01-02-2005, 03:19 PM

Just remember sending anything alive is always a risk when it's cold in Minnesota. Even heat packs can't always help incase of delays.

Fahz · 01-02-2005, 03:55 PM

Bio-load is a big factor in new reefers getting into trouble. Bio-load includes fish, corals, inverts, and fish food. I prefer to see new setups not add fish for the first two months. The first step I like to see is the addition of inverts to clean up the live rock and get algae in check. Then a few coral colonies and a fish or two. The rule of thumb I like to see is no more then one large or two small fish added every two or three weeks. Remember a fish and the food to sustain it is a big jump in the bio-load. Half a dozen fish in a fifty gallon tank seems to be a good round number to shoot for over time.

Fahz