soda-pop sand?

[herald]

So The 125 is setup with a few corals and a couple of fish. 1 bubble, 1 leather, 1 frogspawn, 1 open brain. 1 tomato clown and a 2 leftover Blue Damsels from cycling. The PH is 8.4, Ammonia is 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate <5 ppm, 0 Cu, 0 Phosphates, Calcium is nearly 600 mg/L (A bit high, I know, but my water is naturally that way). I've had another outbreak of Red Cyano since my newest additions (frogspawn and leather) I assume I got a bit of LFS in the tank during transfer...perhaps the source of Cyano

Lighting is 4X140 VHO (2 daylight, 2 blue) and 2X 175watt MH 10K (probably go to 14Ks next time).

The real question is...that over the last week I have noticed some bubbling from the sandbed (3-4 inches deep throughout) as of today the bubbles have increased to the point that it looks like I'm running my tank with 7-Up instead of water (exaggeration). Literally, the bubbles are creating a blanket across the highly-lit areas of the sandbed. bubbles are about 2 or so mm across...periodically breaking free and floating to the surface..

I assume the bubbles are nitrogen forming in the sand...I know that some ppl have had problems with LARGE nitrogen bubbles damaging their PH, but my PH has been solid for 9 mos. looking at the sandine at the glass, it appears the bubbles are forming only in the top 1 inch of sand. Can anyone give me any tips on how to deal with this? I have about 12 blue leg hermits and 15 snails working on the Cyano, and I will be doing a big order from ISPF next week for more detritivores...

Oh...I have one largish brittle-star (5inch across inc. legs). He hasn't been moving much since I added him a couple of days ago...

It doesn't seem to be harming the tank, but it doesn't seem right either...

Thanks in advance for any help.

- Chris

[MontanaRocknReefer]

Hi there! What type brittle star do you have? My green brittle star stays pretty still underneath his rock and really makes an appearance when it is feeding time! Fun to observe!

I have bubbles in my sandbed and can see them about 1-2" below the sand surface and they release every now and then and this is only normal. Your sandbed is working!

Here is a pic of my green brittle star:

[Allyson]

When I introduced my brittle star to my tank it hid for about a week or so unless I was feeding it. Just recently...within the last week, he's felt comfortable enough to be partly exposed for long periods of time.

[Alice]

Hi

The bubbles should pass; your sandbed is doing what it should. Go slow on further additions to give it some time to keep up with the bioload.

Has your star been eating? Feed it directly with a small piece of shrimp, fish etc. Hold it right by its' arms where it can grab it. The way my serpent star grabs food, I'm glad he's not bigger-he'd likely take my hand with it!

Alice

[herald]

Thanks for the replies!

My brittle star is very similar to the posted picture, except it has black bristles that are a touch thicker than the depicted ones are.

The bubbling has increased, but as of my testing today I have my nitrates have dropped to undetectable levels YAY. I am assuming denitrifying bacteria are doing their thing.

The only problem remaining is what I believe to be Cyano (a brown colored slimy algae substance) is overtaking the tank at a tremendous rate. I have 15 turbo snails and 12 blue leg hermits in there but they aren't keeping up. My LFS keeps trying to get me to buy some magic powder that fixes Cyano (uh-huh, and what's it gonna do to the rest of my tank?) I am trying to find the right critters to eat this stuff up...recommendatations would be greatly appreciated.

- Chris

[Junkzoo]

Chris, IMO hold off on getting the magic powder from the LFS,,add/adjust water movement on/near the problem area, try to keep your nutrient level/feeding down a bit, and wait it out. what you have is pretty normal for the age of your tank, i think most all of us have gone thru the same thing at one time or another,,oh, PS:if you can siphon any of the larger growth out , it will help too.

[FishDaddy]

Chris,
There are few critters that will eat Cyano and even then, not enough to control the usual outbreak. Cyano commonly occurs in newer tanks and even established tanks when there are changes in tank conditions that favor its growth.

The best way to eliminate and control cyano is the old-fashioned way, not with magic powders and potions. Even if the additive does no harm, it won't cure the underlying cause and can re-occur.

Here are the major methods of attacking the problem, often you need to utilize them all:
1) Water quality- use RO/DI water and do regular water changes.
2) Cut back on feeding to reduce organic matter.
3) Make sure you have current bulbs of the correct Kelvin temp.
4) Make sure you have adequate circulation in all areas of the tank, particularly good flow across the substrate.
5) Effective protein skimming.
6) Drip Kalkwasser for all top-off water. The Kalk will help bind the PO4 ions for removal via the skimmer.
7) Good clean up crew of snails to remove detritus and excess food before it converts to Nitrates.
8) Physical removal with a turkey baster....suck the slime up!

I had an outbreak when the tank was about a year old. I did all the above, especially adding another powerhead at the bottom to sweep across the substrate. Cyano doesn't like circulation.
HTH,
Dick

[herald]

I have been reading Deelbek and Sprung, talking to my LFS (3 different ones, in fact) and I am thinking that perhaps I don't have a cyano problem, but rather a Diatoms problem.

all areas of the substrate in direct light have built a layer of brown stuff on it. The snails seemed to like it at first now they aren't touching it hardly at all...

What started as a sort of golden brown has turned dark over subsequent days so that some areas have become quite dark. I am scraping the glass once a day to get the film off, the rocks are 50% covered at this point...

Bought a new skimmer yesterday (G2 type) and its crankin'. I will begin 10% water changes every few days until I see some improvement or everything dies and I drain it and start over.

My thinking at this point is as follows: I am misjudged Diatoms as Red Cyano, and have been thinking in terms of dissolved organics as opposed to a source for diatoms. all of my tested levels are rock solid PH 8.4, CU 0, Phosphate 0, Ammonia 0, NO2 0, NO3 <5ppm. But my tank was filled with tap water, make-up and waterchanges have all been tap water. I think that maybe I have high silicates in my tap and that is feeding the diatoms. I bought an R/O unit yesterday and am making water like mad to start changing out the tanks water.

BTW, on the bubbling issue posted earlier in this thread. That problem has not gone away. It seems to be tied to the light levels in the tank. When I am running all of the lights the bubbling is far worse than when I am not. It is definitely coming from the substrate as I can see the bubbles forming in the top 1" of sand at the glassline. Thus the issue seems photo-synthetic, but how if it is IN the substrate?

- Chris

[herald]

bump.

Sorry bumping this thread hoping somebody might have some ideas on my last post to it.

- Chris

[FishDaddy]

Chris,
I think you are doing all the right things. The skimmer and RO will help, as well as the other things we mentioned, whether it be cyano or diatoms. Diatoms will clear up more quickly than cyano but following those steps will make it happen.
What is the photoperiod of your lights? Sometimes cutting back on the lighting period will help curb the algae growth.

For some excellent information, check the Algae Control section of Joaco's site:
http://www.wyx.com/iheo/tank/new.htm
These pictures are from his site:
Diatoms:

Cyano:


Diatoms are a normal part of the maturation process of a new tank, just as the bubbling in the sand. Neither are life-threatening to your tank. Cyano can be controlled and eliminated; it just takes more time.
HTH,
Dick

[herald]

I am still playing with the photo period. I started with gradually bringing lights on at 9am (2 140W VHO daylights), 11am 2X140W VHO Actinic Blues, 1pm 2X175W MH, 7pm MH goes off, 10pm VHO WHites go off, midnight Actinic blues go off. giving a total photo period of 15 hours.

I know, I know...way too long right? I am not running the MHs right now and I have trimmed the VHOs down to 12 hours a day (noon- midnight)

My thinking is that I will run a total photo period of about 12 hours a day with the MHs on for 4-6 hours.

- Chris

[Allyson]

To add to the tips that Fishdaddy & the others have given....my Queen Conch loves the brown diatoms/algae. It seems that she can't get enough of it. I caught her halfway up a rock yesterday trying to get to a small patch....and she doesn't like climbing. But I wouldn't recommend getting too many as the one that I have does at least 2 tours of my 30 gal sandbed & lower rocks daily and still looks hungry.

Thanks go out to Doug who I think was the one who recommended getting a conch.