Why don't people use mollies to cycle new tanks anymore

[Doug1]

Hmmmmmmmmm its the **** ethical issue again. If one takes the all life is sacred approach then one has to acknowledge that any interference in the natural order of things is morally, and ethically wrong. That supposes that all pet dogs and cats are victims of human oppression along with any otheeer companion animals we me encounter.
On the other hand I dont think that was CWA's intent and the question is valid. Having ben involved with the set up of a few tanks over the years indulge me if you will. Old school(back in the 70's) had you using a few hardy fish be they damsels or Mollies, ect.
Now a days we have access to real Live Rock and sand, something that was basically unheard of then, that will definatly jump start biofiltration. Many of the methods outlined will result in a cycled tanked, it may be a week later or a month and a half later, but bottom line you can set up a new tank with no live rock or sand and throw in some food from time to time and it will cycle in about the same time as if you add damsels or mollies to a sterile tank. The only short cut is with live rock and sand but even then patience is always a virtue and 6 months to cycle, bloom and stabilize is always a good idea.
For those that want immediate gratification there are hardy fish that will put up with the stress of a new cycling tank, but in the long run a slower approach is better IME.
Addressing the question specifically I am surprised more people don't use various Mollinesia to cycle with, they are more tolerent even than damsels and being live beareers are generally prolific even in SW, the young can be a valuable food source, even for fish like lions, esp if gut loaded with Selcon enhanced foods. I know this may sound callous to some new comers but a wild coral reef if is one of the wildest, most dangerous places on the face of the earth, Unless you are a great white its all food

[MontanaRocknReefer]

Well this is a tough one cwa46. This is an excellent reply and will make us think.
All I can say is with fish we can pretty much control what fish we can cycle with and the decision we make to accomplish this feat.
With LR we really do not have much control over the thousands upon thousands of living organisms in a piece of live rock and so much of the living organism have a very short live span and alot of them will be consumed by all the inhabitants of the reef aquarium.
There is a lot of life and death on a reef(whether in the wild ocean or in our aquariums)that we as hobbyist learn is the natural cycle of things but we do try to find alternatives and solutions to minimize the hardships which includes death on our inhabitants.
Maybe I am way off base here but you came up with a hard question and I am not sure there is no easy answer to that one. Johnny

[sculpin]

I don't think Jerel or I were being serious in using fish to cycle tanks. This was more a discussion of some of the less commonly kept but hardier brackish and saltwater species that do well in reef tanks. In truth, many of these fish were used to cycle tanks in the past simply because they do have substantially higher tolerance for extreme water conditions, being exposed to such conditions in their natural environments (typically salt marshes and flats).

[Spanky]

Ditto, what Mike said.

Anywho, Mike, a long time ago I remember we were looking for a picture of "Lophogobius cyprinoides" on the internet. Did we find one? I can't remember. I looked at all the obvious places this morning, zip.

Jerel

[Junkzoo]

Hi Jerel,,,just joined this,(yet another board)looks like a lot of activity here.have not been "teased" by any of your pics of your "pets" in your BIG aquarium out your door lately,,been spending too much time at Este's lately?(inside conch joke)

[Spanky]

Well I'll be darned!

Hail Hail the gangs all here.

We need to ask Brooke to start a sub-forum for all us diver/biologist/keys types.

Junkzoo

Jerel

[Junkzoo]

sounds like a winner to me!have to come on down and do some bridge diving,and go out and "swim with the fishes"on the reefs,,,then of course ,Holiday Isle afterwords,,,,,,ahhhhh,,,,Keys Disease,,,,,

[galleon]

I was born with Keys Disease...
A conch to last.
Vive la concha!

[sculpin]

Boy, somebody break out the Buffet...

[cath]

It's after midnight here, so it's about time I posted.

When I was cycling my tank last summer, I used one lonely piece of shrimp from the fish department at the grocery store. I'm a veggie, and I asked for just one shrimp,and the butcher looked at me like I was nutz. I kept that poor shrimp in the tank...all by itself for about a week. ALice, Doug and Dick really had a kick outa my technique. Tank cycled just fine, and no spike to worry about.

I just don't like the idea of using mollies to cycle. My oldest brother did that a number of years ago in his SWFO tank, but that's not for Cath.

Slow and easy is good.

[Junkzoo]

Somebody say BUFFETT???closest thing to 'da Keys is going to see the head Parrot-head in Chicago Sept.12th!!!gonna bring my Rum-Runners,and a glass of my sump water to get the "feel" o' da Keys too!AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

[Doug1]

For some reason I thought this might bring the parrot heads out. I guess we will have to vote the CRB as the official TRT band
Seriously, this thread does raise some vital issues. As a board( ie a group of volunteer moderators) we take the stand that there are many ways to reach the goal of successful reef husbandry. There is no one absolute right way but I think for the most part we try to examine the ethics of the hbby in general, and recommend what works for most people. I think that most of the contributing members of the board are in favor of ethical treatment of the animals we adopt, and try to relay info that gives everyone at least a fair chance of enjoying their own little slice of the ocean. Obviously it can get to be as complex an issue as one wants to make it, but the general thrust of this board is to help newcomers to the hobby make informed choices, increase awareness of the issues involved and improve the educational level of the participants. If you look at it from that aspect it is a monumental task but I feel we have done a fair job of providing info outright and links for those who want to take it further. We have a great staff that is always learning, and several members who are active in the marine bio field who take the time to share with everyone, and we have a nice friendly place to hang out. OK we are a little off the wall at times but heck we have fun. If all the new mewmbers that have signed on lately get half of what I have out of this we will have accomplished the goal we set out way back when.
Thank you dedicated staff and especially the "Big Dog Reefers" who keep answering the same questions.

[Spanky]

Doug, well said.

Jerel

[JennM]

Hmmm *somebody* had to have killed that shrimp from the butcher's....

I too, practise fishless cycling. LR is the way to go, and whenever I can, I use cured rock and add fish VERRRRRRY slowly. That minimizes the die-off all around.

I know of some "sterile" tank keepers (afraid of LR/LS and all the other great stuff it affords) who have cycled using a few drops of household ammonia I'm not brave enough to try that.

On the subject of mollies...the first time I heard of it, I thought, GEEZ how inhumane! Then I learned that in the wild the fish are sometimes found in fresh water to brackish to full salinity. When I started keeping seahorses, I got a handful of mollies, acclimated them to saltwater (very easy to do, I was surprised!) and I have a small tank of them *supposedly* to be breeding for seahorse food. Unfortunately, they've only produced a couple of babies, and I've only got one left, and I've grown rather fond of him!!

So, at this stage of the game, they are more "decorative" ....but I like them!

Jenn <---8 (tanks) is enough.

[Alice]

JennM;

Only 8 tanks? Aw c'mon, there's room for a nano by the bathroom sink