Carbon use??? (plus green algae and dead star)

[Candyman]

I took all the carbon out of my Fluval when I got my sump and new pritein skimmer. Since then my water has started to turn cloudy. Ihave since put the carbon back in and the water clears up. What i sthe disavantages of having carbon in my reef tank. I sure like the clear water, but I want my reef tank to thrive with coraline algae and coral growth will the carbon prevent this?

[ 03-01-2001: Message edited by: Candyman ]

[smpolyp]

Using carbon dose absorb both nutrients and some trace elements. I do not like using it much at all due to the later. If you do find that you have to use it to keep your water clear you may want to find out what could be causing the dirty water. If you are using the sponge and or the ceramic media in the fluval you could be harboring waste. Tell us more about your current system.

[Candyman]

I have a 55 gal tank with a sump and a venturi skimmer both purchased about 3 weeks ago. Also both are from US Aquarium. I have a powersweep for water movement and I also have a Fluval 304 and yes I still have the ceramic media in it, do I need to remove this? I only have about 25 lbs. of live rock which I intend on adding about 30 lbs. more this week.

[bill-e]

I spent 20 minutes replying to you yesterday and when I hit "add reply", the board errored and lost my reply. Here it goes again.

First, your real problem is that your tank gets cloudy without the carbon. We need to determine what is wrong and fix that.

Carbon filters by catching organics and some trace elements in it's numorous and very small pores. Good quality carbon under a good flow of water as in a filter normally fills all it's pores in 48-72 hours. After that, the carbon becomes a biological filter.

Whether or not is is detrimental to your reef is up to debate, most dont use it regularly but some do and with good results. I personally run 8 ounces of carbon in my HOT Magnum filter once every month and a half for 48-72 hours. Then I return the filter to my grow out tank where it performs biological filtration until the next time I replace the carbon and run it on my main tank.

The bottom line is that you should not need to run the carbon. Perhaps once you add the additional live rock the rock and skimmer will be able to keep up with your bioload. Your goal is to be able to remove the Fluval completely.

What is your bioload by the way?

[Candyman]

Right now besides the live rock and clean up crew only a mandraine goby whose is flourishing on what seems to be over a 1000 isopods and copipods. O yeah I did have a sand star that only lived for about a week and then he died that could have been some of the cloudy water but I removed him the day I knew he was dead and the water was still cloudy for over a week. That is when I added the carbon. By the way any clues as to why my starfish died. I had my water tested and they said my water conditions were perfect 0 Ammin. 0 nit. PH 8.4 temp 79 calcium 550 can't figure it out. Also still can't get rid of the green algae and brown dusting algae and yes I've been using RO or DI, but only for the last month. I might still have phosphates from the before when I used tap water. My protein skimmer is now working great since it is good and broke in. I'm bum fuzzled about the star and algae.

[bill-e]

How old is the tank? With only the mandarin, 30 lbs of live rock should be plenty.

How about Nitrates?

Who knows on the star, acclimation may not have been long enough.

[Candyman]

0 nitrates as well. Also Alkalinity was 12. I was thinking about buying about 30 or 40 lbs. of the coraline live rock from www.gulf-view.com any one had any luck with them. Other sites say their product is great. O yea tank is 2 years old.

[smpolyp]

As bill-e said it could be acclimation on the star. Also you said that it was a sand star. It also could have starved after depleating the sand. I would test the phosphate to see exactly were you stand on a two year old tank. With a cal of 550 ppm is a high number for a alk of 4.29 meg/l 12 dkh. Were these numbers taken at the same time?

[smpolyp]

I would cure the 30 lbs of rock you plan to add in a seperate vat. This way if there is any die off you will not get an ammonia spike and risk lossing anything. Once you introduce that 30 lbs test for the next few days. If you see 0 ammonia and 0 nitrite you can start pulling out that ceramic media. I would pull out half at a time over a week period to insure a good amount of bacteria for the tank. Then start looking at your phosphate levels. With adding new rock you normally see an elevation of phosphate. Simply do a few good water changes with RO water to get them down and things should pick up from there. I would also make sure you have plenty of water movement in the tank. For your return pump from the sump look at the amount of head pressure you have and apply this to the chart that comes with the pump. Make sure you have a good turn over rate 8 or more times is best. With extra power heads in the tank the turn over rate may be less, but still look for a good amount of flow through your sump return as it will help bring the organic slick that is on top to your skimmer.

[Candyman]

Yes. I had it tested at my LFS because I wanted an accurate reading. Also when you say depleted my sand bed what are you meaning. Also if I get another one can they be feed to stay alive?

[FishDaddy]

Candyman,
Do you know the species name for the starfish? "Sandstar" is a generic name that could cover a wide variety of stars. Stars that are considered "sand sifters" do deplete the fauna in the sandbed.
Since your star only lasted a week, I would suspect insufficient acclimation or the star could have been in poor condition when you got it. Starfish are particularly vulnerable to changes in water conditions and a long, slow drip acclimation is necessary. Drip over a period of many hours until you have added about 4 times as much tank water as the shipping water. I would do this in a bucket with an airstone and a small heater adjusted to your tank temp.
If you are considering another star, please get the scientific name and float it on the board first then someone can give you more particulars.

As for the new rock, whichever you get, adding that much to your system can cause an ammonia spike, even if the rock is "fully cured", there will be some die off. Following smpolyp's advice, I would let it cure in a large rubbermaid tub with a powerhead for circulation and heat to tank temp. for several days, until you get 0 ammonia/nitrate readings. You might even do a water change during the process.
HTH
Dick

[Candyman]

Fishdaddy you live near me I believe. I am close to the Knoxville area and most of my supplies I get from The Aquarium on Homberg Drive. I don't especially like the looks of their live rock however and was wondering where you got yours. Do you recommend on other LFS in this area.

[Doug1]

When purchasing sea stars try to get one that has been in the store for a few weeks. Unforyunatly most of the damaga occurs from shipping changes, and if you get a newly arrived one it maybe on its way out by the time you get it, esp if one does a basic float and dip. Long and slow is the way to go
Another reason for curing the rock seperatly is Fla rock frequently comes with bonus rock crabs and or mantis shrimp. Neither are fun trying to remove form an established reef after the fact

[FishDaddy]

Hey Candyman,
Give Aquatic Specialists a try. That is the store founded by John Tullock, located on North Broadway, about a mile and a half South of 1-640. Randall Surrette is the owner and managed the store when Tullock owned it. Randall and his wife, Lisa, are good folks. http://www.aquatic-specialists.com/
I got my first 30# live rock from Premium Aquatics by MO but have since bought several batches from AS. They have top quality Fiji and sometimes some Tonga or Marshall. AS does MO as well.
There's a small store in Sevierville, where I live,Sevierville Wet Pets, that has getting into saltwater, though they have been primarily freshwater. James Karow and his family run this store and they are really nice people.

It has been my experience, whether dealing with aquarium stores or any other type merchant, that getting to know the owners and doing business with friends is the best way. Whenever I need anything, these two stores get my business first. If they don't have it, then I go MO.
Dick

[Candyman]

I have been to AS I really didn't see any good pieces of LR but they could have been out of the good pieces that day.