Sponsor Our Community
Go Back   The Reef Tank > The Reference Place > Water Chemistry Archive

Water Chemistry Archive
Water Chemistry Links


Registered Members don't see these ads. Register now it's free!

 
 
Thread Tools
Old 01-22-2002, 10:02 PM   #1
Flatfish
Member
 
Flatfish's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Bend, OR
Posts: 200
Images: 16

Pickling Lime?


I know I'm being cheap, but for those that dose...

I recently read that pickling lime and Kalkwasser have the same essential ingredient (calcium hydroxide). Further, that pickling lime can be used in the place of Kalkwasser as a calcium supplement. The main advantage of Kalkwasser is that it is designed to dissolve more easily and therefore it more convenient to apply.

I’ve found several references to this topic on the Net. Has anyone done this?

There are only a few corals in my tank and I can justify the cost of a calcium reactor...yet. I can pick up a large can of food grade pickling lime at the store for about two bucks.

Thanks!
Joe
Registered Members don't see these ads. Register now it's free!
__________________
Life on the bottom...everything's looking up.
My Tank Specs
Pics Are Here

Last edited by Flatfish; 01-22-2002 at 10:05 PM.
Flatfish is offline  
Old 01-22-2002, 10:08 PM   #2
SteveNichols
Little Fishy
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Nicholasville,KY USA
Posts: 399
I have done it for 3-4 years. No problem.
SteveNichols is offline  
Old 01-22-2002, 10:13 PM   #3
Fishaholic
Little Fishy
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Lake Park Georgia, United States of America
Posts: 183
Pickling Lime and Kalkwasser are the same exact thing minus the nice label and fancy german name.

I use it and so do many others. One of them Julian Sprung.

It is mixed at th same rate as it is the same thing, 2 tablespoons per gallon.

I also mix it first in 20 ml of white vinager (acetic acid).

Both Pickling Lime and Kalkwasser are not batched, they are mined and both at the same purity, some claim Kalkwasser is a higher grade but it does not prove to be.

Hope this helps.
__________________
Dave and Ivy

Dave and Ivy's Aquariums
Fishaholic is offline  
Old 01-22-2002, 10:15 PM   #4
Doug1
Ghost of reefers past
 
Doug1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 1999
Location: Southern Oregon, Way West of Dimples ;)
Posts: 25,140
Images: 13
Can you say Ball or Mrs Wages pickling lime
Same thing, maybe a tad coarser grade. Bill E reports it eats up a powerhhead in his kalk reactor faster but otherwise, not a problem
__________________
Cowboy is a verb, not a noun
Doug1 is offline  
Old 01-22-2002, 10:26 PM   #5
asmith
Jedi Master
 
asmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 1,437
Images: 1
Lets just say that my wife gave me 5 pounds of Balls pickling lime for Christmas. It was the best gift ever.

Andrew
__________________
I'm living so far beyond my income that we may almost be said to be living apart. e.e.cummings

asmith is offline  
Old 01-23-2002, 08:00 AM   #6
FishDaddy
Super Moderator
 
FishDaddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: TN, USA
Posts: 9,692
I've used Pickling Lime for over 2 years; can't tell the difference from the high-priced spread.
The last "real" Kalkwasser cost me $12 for 8 oz. Mrs. Wages costs me $1.19 per lb. at Kroger!
Incidentally, I have noticed that Mrs. Wages seems slightly whiter than Ball Pickling Lime. After mixing, Ball seems to leave a little more particulate in suspension. Almost imperceptible, but it makes me prefer Mrs. Wages.
Dick
__________________
Every day is a good day but some are gooder than others!!
http://users.zoominternet.net/~kathywerner/gifs/jumping_fish.gif
FishDaddy is offline  
Old 01-24-2002, 02:16 AM   #7
tdwyatt
senior member
 
tdwyatt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Walnut Grove, SC, USA
Posts: 15,170
Images: 46
Quote:
Originally posted by Fishaholic
Pickling Lime and Kalkwasser are the same exact thing minus the nice label and fancy german name.
Essentially this is true, although based on the initial grade of the limestone that is used to make the Calcium oxide it may differ...

Quote:
It is mixed at th same rate as it is the same thing, 2 tablespoons per gallon... ...I also mix it first in 20 ml of white vinager (acetic acid)...
Mixing direction rate is correct, but using Vinegar defeats the purpose of using Ca(OH)2 to start with. You end up with a solution of Ca acetate (very soluble) and water, instead of Calcium carbonate/bicarbonate (relatively insoluble) ions ... this will initially drop pH and will not help to maintain buffer capacity nearly as well as saturating a solution with Calcium oxide/ calcium hydroxide to provide for the buffering effect from the carbonate/bicarbonate ions. Although 20 ml of vinegar is not enough to completely neutralize the buffer present, it will prevent it's initial formation, as acetate ion is an organic acid, and the protons they donate to the solution will actually neutralize some of the existing buffer capacity of the system. Buffer will come back up somewhat, but the addition of acetic acid in the form of vinegar is totally unnecessary, even detrimental in view of what our expected outcome should be.

Quote:
...Both Pickling Lime and Kalkwasser are not batched, they are mined and both at the same purity, some claim Kalkwasser is a higher grade but it does not prove to be...
I'm not sure what you mean by "batched", but these products are made in "batches" and have lot numbers for the batches in which they are produced. Kalk and pickling lime are both mixtures of (very little) Calcium Oxide ( CaO ) and (mostly) Calcium Hydroxide ( Ca(OH)2 ). They are mined only in the sense that the raw precursor to make these products is mined Calcium Carbonate, either as marble that is not suitable for construction or deposits of Chalk or high purity limestone.

The products we seek are made first through the production of Calcium Oxide, then the manufacture of a more stable Calcium Hydroxide. Calcium Oxide is made by calcining a relatively pure native calcium carbonate, e.g., marble chips, chalk or limestone in a suitable kiln where the carbonate will be removed as carbon dioxide, leaving behind CaO. This kiln is usually a vertical cylinder of either steel or masonry lined with firebrick, heated by a boxed heat source (usually gas-fired) near the base of the kiln. The kiln is arraigned so that the entire mass of the limestone is exposed to the combustion products of the furnace without coming into actual contact with the flame. Large amounts of lime can be cheaply made in this manner using rotary furnaces. I might point out that this is also one of the sources of reef destruction in the South Pacific. Reefs are mined for their limestone (skeletons) to supply lime used for road and related structure construction.

Native Calcium Carbonates contain varying amounts of impurities, usually oxides and carbonates of magnesium, iron, silica, and varying clays. The final grade of the lime is determined by assay of the final product, and may vary from Pharmaceutical to construction grade. If there is enough of the clay present, the final product is called "over-burnt lime" and is used to make a quicklime product that is suitable only for construction/mortar purposes. The Calcium Oxide is the precursor for the production of Calcium Hydroxide, also known as "slaked lime", so called because it is thirsty for water (I will explain).

Also called "hydrated lime", Calcium Hydroxide is made by the careful addition of a limited amount of water to lime (Calcium Oxide). This process is known as "slaking" and is characterized by the avid absorption of water by the oxide to form Calcium Hydroxide in an extremely exothermic reaction.

Calcium hydroxide solutions are basic by reaction with water (pH of the saturated solution at room temp is 12.3) with a solubility of 1 gm in 630 ml of water at 25C. Solubility goes down as temp goes up (greater reactivity results in more precipitate, remember, solution for this product is exothermic) to around 1 gm in 1300 ml water at 100C. Freshly made solutions of this substance will be clear, but will turn cloudy as they absorb carbon dioxide from the atmosphere to form Calcium Carbonate. This is not the initial precipitate seen when mixing the solution, that is from the excess Ca(OH)2. Allow this to settle out, and you can use the supernatant liquid (the clear liquid above the precipitate layer). Store this solution in a tightly close container, and to dose it, use a closed collapsible container to prevent the introduction of CO2.

If you want to test the purity of the lime that you have, I have the assay tests for Ca(OH)2 for those of you that might be interested, or you can contact the USP on the Internet for the assay standards.

Heh, just my $0.02 US ... Hope this clears up any misconception on this product. Although the pickling lime may not be pharmaceutical grade, it supplies the things we want without supplying an unacceptable level of contaminates (food grade is almost pharmaceutical grade)
__________________
Tom <"))))>(
(TDWyatt)
Wise men speak because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something. -Plato
tdwyatt is offline  
Old 01-24-2002, 10:54 AM   #8
Flatfish
Member
 
Flatfish's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Bend, OR
Posts: 200
Images: 16
Tdwyatt – practice a little chemistry do ya?
__________________
Life on the bottom...everything's looking up.
My Tank Specs
Pics Are Here
Flatfish is offline  
Old 01-24-2002, 02:01 PM   #9
FishDaddy
Super Moderator
 
FishDaddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: TN, USA
Posts: 9,692
*Tagged For Archives*
__________________
Every day is a good day but some are gooder than others!!
http://users.zoominternet.net/~kathywerner/gifs/jumping_fish.gif
FishDaddy is offline  
Comparison Shopping
Peticious.com

As low as $0

at sellers

1/3 HP PRIME CHILLER W SINGLE STAGE THERMOSTAT

As low as $500

at 7 sellers

Members with more than 50 posts don't see this bar

Tunze Algae Magnet 40 mm 220.560

As low as $189

at 4 sellers

150 Watt 10000K Metal Halide Bulb Double-Ended (All Brands)

As low as $10

at 33 sellers

Members with more than 50 posts don't see this bar

175 Watt Metal Halide Ballast - Transformer and Capacitor Only

As low as $53

at 4 sellers

Impeller Well Cover for Fluval 304 404 Canister Filters - New Style

As low as $6

at 4 sellers

Members with more than 50 posts don't see this bar

Aqua Clear Power Head Model 110 900 GPH

As low as $69

at 7 sellers

Ocean Nutrition Formula Two Medium Pellet 14 oz / 400g

As low as $13

at 14 sellers

Members with more than 50 posts don't see this bar

Hagen Fluval FX5 Replacement Filter Lid O-Ring Fluval A-20210

As low as $8

at 3 sellers

Filter Media Bag 6 inch x 10 inch - 800 Micron

As low as $5

at 3 sellers

Members with more than 50 posts don't see this bar

Seachem Nourish 250ml 8.5oz

As low as $5

at 15 sellers

Hagen Fluval 405 Canister Filter 340 GPH

As low as $3

at 27 sellers

Members with more than 50 posts don't see this bar

Zoo Med Powersweep 226 Max 190 GPH

As low as $21

at 16 sellers

Danner 02675 HY Drive 4000GPH Pump

As low as $168

at 13 sellers

Members with more than 50 posts don't see this bar

 

Tags
acetic acid , ball pickling lime , balls pickling lime , calcium hydroxide solution , calcium reactor , julian sprung , kalk reactor , mrs wages pickling lime , wages pickling lime




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Sitemap:1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196
Sponsor Our Community

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:39 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2009, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Our lawyer tells us that, by pressing the "New Thread" or "New Reply" button, you acknowledge that the opinions and information expressed in your article are yours alone and not those of thereeftank.com, dba The Reef Tank. Further, you agree to indemnify The Reef Tank, its moderators, administrators and agents from any and all liability which may arise as a result of your article. (C)opyright 2006 TheReefTank.com
 
close
Sign up for free and join one of the largest communities of saltwater aquarists!
Our members will be glad to help you with anything you need!

Join over 30,000 TRT members!

Email

Email Confirm Email
Username
Password Confirm Password

I agree to the website rules