went shopping with a friend: he dropped the dime.

[Fat Tony]

Yep Tom, as we talked about earlier in the week.. that is the one! I'm soooooo envious right now!!!

[tdwyatt]

Originally Posted by wfuavenger

he should have gotten an Audi..... My mother had a 745iL and it fell apart at 55k miles....litterally. the car was babied and garaged its whole life. The front grill fell off, one of the valves leaked, the A/C broke, the seats started to come undone at the seams and plenty of other things....

7 series attract that kind of "I don't do anything to my car" type buyers, and as such, lots of stuff stays left undone until it is a crisis (check some of the Internet sites for the 7 series). This is true with a lot of the upper end cars, regardless of where they were made or by whom. If you take care of most cars, they will last well above the 150k mile mark, but this is especially true for the German marquees. The only reason I have changed cars in the past has been based on a collector's desire to own the 88 (heh, I employeed the Japanese "NO"), and I totalled the 90.

I have had three M cars, 237000 milies on an 88, 197000 on a 90, and 177000 on my current one (which, btw on this trip to Wilmington got 31 MPG driving between 70-75 MPH w/ ac on the entire way). I think that BMW has lost the pulse of the American market, BMW must still feel that "BIGGER IS BETTER" in the American mindset. I've driven the new E92 M3, and it is, indeed, a MONSTER. HOWEVER, check the EPA estimates for this vehicle. BMW has lost the concept of a light, well-powered, nimble, agile well-mannered M car, as the new one weighs in at 3700+ lbs (convertible is 4100+ lbs) with the monster V8, and you can feel all that weight in the corners (but with that 414 HP 4.0L engine, it really doesn't matter when steering with the throttle...) My biggest concern is that it gets around 15 MPG as reported by real owners in the UShttp://forums.roadfly.com/forums/bmw...8906012-1.html I find it incredulous that in these days of dwindling gas availability and soaring gas prices that ANYONE would come out with such a car geared toward the market it is set for, whether it is based on "affording" gas or not. This is especially true when you consider all the tech that went into this car to make it LIGHT (see the link). I put comments I hear about this issue like: "If you can afford the car, then you can afford the gas" right up there with...

Originally Posted by Senator Joe Biden

"I think it is your patriotic duty to pay a higher tax rate if you make more than $250,000 a year"

All you need to do is spend one afternoon looking for a gas station with 93 octane gas (or any gas as of late in the SouthEast) to make MPG a very important part of the formula to buy a new car.

My E36 with 3.2L S52 Euro setup makes 330 HP in a car that weighs 3150 lbs without taking anything out of the car. The E46 makes the same HP but weighs in at 3415 lbs and averages 22MPG on trips below 70 MPH. My E36 gets 30+ MPG on trips, is cheap to insure(well, relatively ), property taxes are not too bad, and IT'S PAID FOR. Even though I occasionally get the itch for an E46 or the new E92 M-car, I think I will be rebuilding the engine, tranny, diff, etc. of the E36 before I buy the E92 or E93 M cars... I am even thinking of buying a VW Rabbit or a Cooper Mini that runs on CNG for a dailly driver and making the M a garage queen.

Look at this site for more stats on the M cars, some of it is not exactly right, but for the most part it describes the line well: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_M3

[tdwyatt]

Originally Posted by Doug1

They mentioned 45K price for the Z4, when they offer the coupe in a clth seat and 1.6 TDI model rated at 60 for under 20K I will be all over it, ,but considering the loud flushing sound come from the Federal Reserve I am not holding my breath

Doug, you need to find a copy of the lateset Roundel, it has an article about that vehicle. Right now, BMW is enjoying their market position as a luxury car provider, is trying to capture a greater percentage of tht market, and has stated that at this time, the TDI vehicle "does not match with their current plans for the market in NA." uch a shame, the vehicle you've described is in much of the world now and gets 45 MPG (diesel) and has 6 second 0-60 times. It is based on the 123i and the British Automotive press thinks it is the car of the future.

[Phishnoob]

Tom I am happy as can be with our 28 mpg today touring seeing fall color in the Z3. With just 184 hp in 2800 lbs and a good close ratio gearbox there was plenty of power to pass five cars at a time if necessary.

The new 135i with the twin turbo was too much unusable power for us, and I will take going through the gears with everything matched up knowing that the motor can go 300,000 miles.

[jenglish]

during car discussions on this forum I feel like I came to a polo game on a 3-legged donkey!

[tdwyatt]

Originally Posted by jenglish

during car discussions on this forum I feel like I came to a polo game on a 3-legged donkey!

HAJAAHAHAHAHAhahahahahahahaaaaaaa!

I have the visual on that...

[Doug1]

Originally Posted by jenglish

during car discussions on this forum I feel like I came to a polo game on a 3-legged donkey!

Run what you brung, I love getting owner input on cars, esp the highly hyped upper end cars, shoot, I love cars, Really love BAD cars but that pesky reality thing is always rearing its ugly head

[Fat Tony]

Originally Posted by tdwyatt

This is especially true when you consider all the tech that went into this car to make it LIGHT (see the link). I put comments I hear about this issue like: "If you can afford the car, then you can afford the gas" right up there with...

All you need to do is spend one afternoon looking for a gas station with 93 octane gas (or any gas as of late in the SouthEast) to make MPG a very important part of the formula to buy a new car.

My E36 with 3.2L S52 Euro setup makes 330 HP in a car that weighs 3150 lbs without taking anything out of the car. The E46 makes the same HP but weighs in at 3415 lbs and averages 22MPG on trips below 70 MPH. My E36 gets 30+ MPG on trips, is cheap to insure(well, relatively ), property taxes are not too bad, and IT'S PAID FOR. Even though I occasionally get the itch for an E46 or the new E92 M-car, I think I will be rebuilding the engine, tranny, diff, etc. of the E36 before I buy the E92 or E93 M cars... I am even thinking of buying a VW Rabbit or a Cooper Mini that runs on CNG for a dailly driver and making the M a garage queen.

Look at this site for more stats on the M cars, some of it is not exactly right, but for the most part it describes the line well: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_M3

Tom I get the same reaction to my Lincoln LS... since you can afford the car, obviously you can afford the gas...I get that crap all the time from people who don't own one. I also know your pain with finding that 93 octane. I never did find any that night after the meeting. I took her home parked her and drove my wife's car to work the next day (since it uses 87 ) The only thing that drives me nuts about my car is,270 HP 3.9 V8 and on a trip I get 24 mpg (70-75 mph). But it's a PIG at 4400 lbs curb weight! add me and the wife with some luggage to the mix and it's pushing 4900 lbs!When cruising at that speed I am only turning 2500 rpm and I still only get 24 mpg. Why can't the American cars get as good of gas mileage as the Euro or Asian cars???

[jenglish]

Originally Posted by Fat Tony

Tom I get the same reaction to my Lincoln LS... since you can afford the car, obviously you can afford the gas...I get that crap all the time from people who don't own one. I also know your pain with finding that 93 octane. I never did find any that night after the meeting. I took her home parked her and drove my wife's car to work the next day (since it uses 87 ) The only thing that drives me nuts about my car is,270 HP 3.9 V8 and on a trip I get 24 mpg (70-75 mph). But it's a PIG at 4400 lbs curb weight! add me and the wife with some luggage to the mix and it's pushing 4900 lbs!When cruising at that speed I am only turning 2500 rpm and I still only get 24 mpg. Why can't the American cars get as good of gas mileage as the Euro or Asian cars???

my short answer is weight, the "there is no replacement for displacement" mentality and our love affair with the the V style eingine as oppsed to inline and flat boxer style motors. I would elaborate more but off to class and I am no mechanic or engineer so JMHO

[tdwyatt]

Originally Posted by Doug1

... when they offer the coupe in a clth seat and 1.6 TDI model rated at 60 for under 20K I will be all over it...

http://www.bmwusa.com/Standard/Conte...sxsqblEnuNvg==

[Fat Tony]

Tom, I think I just found my next car 135i 300 hp Twin Turbo I6... yep, I think that's the one for me

[Doug1]

Originally Posted by tdwyatt

http://www.bmwusa.com/Standard/Conte...sxsqblEnuNvg==

Nice i like the Xdrive, but the 335d is cpable of the same mileage I get in Caspar, tho I suspect more fun to drive

Rumor has it the Mini Clubman will be available with a small deisel capable of 60 mpg, tho that might be per Imperial gallon, not sure

[Phishnoob]

Tom I didn't know you had the 330 horse motor in your E36 and thought for some reason the power upgrade changed when the chassis did to the E46. With light weight and that many ponies you are right to hang on to your M car.

They had an M roadster when we got our Z3 that was just insane performance wise (as was the 135i) but the price was nearly double and that was a bit too much of a hit. There will be one in the Noob Manor stable someday though. Our local stealer to their credit let us take everything for a test drive without adult supervision.

For the replacement for my 325Ci I am thinking of ordering a stripped 135i coupe with only a couple of minor options here in a year or two. It will be hard to take the depreciation hit though, when mine will be paid for soon and will last 300,000 miles.

[tdwyatt]

Originally Posted by Phishnoob

Tom I didn't know you had the 330 horse motor in your E36 and thought for some reason the power upgrade changed when the chassis did to the E46. With light weight and that many ponies you are right to hang on to your M car...

It is the Euro version of the E36, an imported imiport. I believe the US version is 240 BHP. I am relly considering buying something as asw daily driver and graging the E36. If I find a nice M somewhere around 2004 to 2006 in the E46 M in good shape and well-taken care of, I'd think about buying it for a daily driver, but to be realistic I still want something that gets much better mileage for a daiy driver.

Mel's VW bug TDI gets in the mid-40's MPG and burns diesel amd has been cheap to operate, why can't they come out with a mini or bring the 1 series turbo-Diesel to the US??? I'd like my car-nut activities not to hurt my other passion (reef).

[Phishnoob]

That makes sense now Tom. I thought all E36 M3's were the 240hp motor which would be a fun motor in my Z3...maybe next time around but Cynthia is really attached to mini-Kermit now.

I looked up the Solo classification for the Z3 and there has to be something wrong. It is listed in Showroom Stock A with some mega serious hardware. I noticed that the M3 is put in a special class excluded from normal Showroom Stock. The list is confusing so I guess when we pull up for tech they will tell us what we are for sure.

Next time I am out there we will have to have Cynthia take Cath for a walk or something and you can take me for a spin (or a drift).