Need some SPS help

[Wiskey]

Originally Posted by Skeety

I don't know...maybe it's "phosphate wicking". One of the few SPS tid-bits I still don't understand.

Bacteria don't know the difference between a coral's skeleton and live rock,... the bacteria migrate phosphate up into the coral's skeleton, this causes algae to grow and the skeleton to turn green.

Originally Posted by Skeety

it's a really light green film that forms. Not really sure what it's called...I'm guessing it's just normal green algae.

Phosphate.

Originally Posted by Skeety

I then grab my gravel vac, and take the end of the tube, and clip it inside my sump. Then take the vacumn end, and begin shoving it in the gravel.

Really, really, really, really, really BAD idea. It may look like the skimmer is getting most of it but you are liberating allot of stagnant water down there, allot of nutrients in forms the skimmer can't get, and allot of bacteria that is just going to die when it hits open water. This is throwing your system in turmoil, I would seriously stop this immediately. All water taken out while siphoning should be discarded. Siphon 1/2 or 1/4 of the sand at a time if necessary, but discard the water.

Originally Posted by Skeety

take my turkey baster and start blowing on the LR. I'm pretty good now at knowing where the usual spots are for some good gunk, but I generally blow everywhere. I do this for about 5-10 minutes

For now I would do one rock at a time leaving a couple of days in between, because by doing this you are doing the same thing as siphoning your sand back into your tank, but to a far smaller scale.

Your dedicated, there is no doubt, but I think that siphoning into the sump thing is a major hold back, and could be your whole problem. First thing stop that, and blast less of your LR at once, check back with us in a month, if it is not any better it is time to talk about that CC and how much easer your life would be with BB or Otholic sand. It will also be time to discuss anaerobic, anitoxic zones that the large gravel does not allow.

Originally Posted by Skeety

have a cigarette....

Good idea, back in 5

HTH,
Whiskey

[Twitterbait]

I am not sure about that either... not to be a pain in the a** whiskey but if the CC bed is so shallow and he has enough water movement then i wouldn't expect the CC bed to be anoxic. the only thing i would do is drain the water into the sump through a filter sock then remove it. that way the crap does not make it back into the system.

one way to test if the bed is anoxic would be to test the o2 level in the tank before and after the siphoning. if it goes down then you have a problem, up... your fine. to test for the black sulphur poisoning i would test for Iron, the black sulphur compounds bind to iron in the water so your Iron levels would drop as well... do these 2 tests before and after your WC and siphon and that should be able to give you a good indication if that is what is causing the problem.


IMO...
Whiskey, I'll meet you by the flagpole after work today

[Wiskey]

Originally Posted by Twitterbait

Whiskey, I'll meet you by the flagpole after work today

You'd better watch it, I spend 2 weeks in Portland every year

Even if the CC bed never goes anti toxic/anarobic there is still a bunch of detritus and bacteria (buisy making their bacterial "soup") and he is kicking all that junk back up into his water colum! Bad news for sure.

I would definitally stop syponing your gravel and draining that water to your sump. If you ever decide to do that again, while you are doing it run a nitrate test

Whiskey

[Twitterbait]

good point, use a filter sock at a minimum to catch more of the stuff.

I have never been in a fair fight before this will be a first.

[Wiskey]

Originally Posted by Twitterbait

I have never been in a fair fight before this will be a first.

You give yourself allot of credit

Whiskey

[ReelFreak]

WOW, that sounds like a litte too much work for the water change.....just dump the water instead of the skimming the vacummed stuff..... I don't think that practice is a good idea......

EDIT: I'd be interested in the test results of a cup full of the "post skimmed" water to see PO4 and NO3 levels, heck even Amm and nitrites might even be present in it?

[skeety]

Gotta do a water change today.

I'll be sucking the crud RIGHT into a bucket. We'll see how doing it this way helps.

I take it you guys just deal with the corraline dyoff from the dropping water level? I liked my old way, cause it never affected the water line up in the display tank.

[Wiskey]

Originally Posted by Skeety

I'll be sucking the crud RIGHT into a bucket. We'll see how doing it this way helps.

Originally Posted by Skeety

I take it you guys just deal with the corraline dyoff from the dropping water level?

I don't really know, I never drain below the level of the rocks, and I don't like coraline on my glass so I try and keep it clean.

One thing you could do is leave the return pump on as you syphon the main tank, then just stop when the return pump runns dry. This way the water level in the main tank won't change.

Whiskey

[skeety]

Originally Posted by Wiskey

One thing you could do is leave the return pump on as you syphon the main tank, then just stop when the return pump runns dry. This way the water level in the main tank won't change.

Whiskey

yeah...already been tossin' that one around in my head. Think I'll try it, but can already picture me with one hand in the tank, the other squeezing the tub to control flow, and my foot stretching out to pull the return pump's plug at the right time. hahahah

[Wiskey]

I wouldn't worry about a pump running dry for the 2 seconds it would take to pull the syphon out of the water and reach down to unplug it. It doesn't have enough time to get too hot, get all the water out of the bearings, or do any damage.

If you are really worried about it, you could always stop syphoning when the water in the sump is 1/16" above the return pump.

Whiskey

[Twitterbait]

suck on some uranium and then try to grow another arm or leg...

[skeety]

well...did my water change yesterday, as directed! hehehe

was done in an hour (that was with the little accident on the floor...hehehe). Gotta say, kind of like this way better.

Only problems are, I know I won't clean my equipment as often now..hahah. But I was pretty anal about that anyways, and probably won't hurt to wait a bit longer.

Also, the fish weren't happy about the new approach at all.

But I did like how easy it was...and I feel MUCH better about how much gunk I ACTUALLY got out of the substrate.

I'll keep you guys posted.

[Wiskey]

Cool deal Your fish may not like the change, but I bet the coral will!

Whiskey

[tdwyatt]

I have not read the thread past the first few posts yet, but subscribing now so I can read it Wednesday evening and Thursday. Personally I'd still suggest dumping the CC bed and go to sand if anything, then get out of the tank uness wearing gloves for a bit, but that is just my initial impression when reading the top of the first few posts. I'd also consider potentials for alleopoathic conflict, as growth and/or bleaching is usually an issue when alleopathy occurs. I will read the thread in depth when I get home from ATL and some work-related travel over the next few days.

Failure-to-thrive will occasionally have some unusual issues driving the situations in the system, and may require some large percentage water changes with a good ole PLAIN INSTANT OCEAN mix to reestablish your proportionality of the ASW mix (ratio of K+, Na+, Cl-, Mg++, SO4-, Ca++, Sr++, and the borates) in some closer approximation of seawawter than what is currently ( ) in your system. I have other thoughts on the topic without delving into the thread, but I'll save that for the next post.

PM Casey, Geoff, and Graham as well, I think their input on the topic will be valuable.

[skeety]

Originally Posted by tdwyatt

PM Casey, Geoff, and Graham as well, I think their input on the topic will be valuable.

Thanks Tom. Like I said, I know it's a long thread...so take your time.

I already did PM Casey and Graham when I PM'd you...forgot about G~ but have since done so. (they'll be hell to pay for that oversight! hahaha. Sorry G~)