Ick question

[KNUTE]

In treating Ick with copper is it nessecery to continue to treat for the 2 weeks recommended, until the spots abate, or something in between or even longer. Does garlic really work and if so how to administer it? Thanks for any input. KNUTE

[Alice]

Treating with copper can be a tricky proposition. If you don't monitor the copper levels you can get the concentration in the hospital tank too high and do permanent, possibly fatal, damage to the fish being treated.

Treating with copper for two weeks seems like an awfully long time to me, then again, I've never had to deal with an outbreak that long. Last time I had one, I treated until the spots abated then made sure that the bare bottom hospital tank stayed clean by syphoning out the bottom and with regular water changes. If your main tank is not infected, you can use the water from that tank.

From what I've read and heard about garlic; yes, it does work. The biggest problem I've read about with garlic is the oil residue that can rest on the top of the water and make you're skimmer go nuts.

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Reefkeeping is my life; I can't afford a hobby too!

[Alice]

I should clarify my first post a little..I only treated with copper for a few days after the spots abated but the fish stayed in the hospital tank for 6 weeks to make sure the parasite had run through it's life cycle.

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Reefkeeping is my life; I can't afford a hobby too!

Keeping in mind, most otherwise healthy fish that are well fed and uncrowded will fight it off on their own. Too many fish in a new unstable tank is almost guarenteed to cause stress and disease http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/frown.gif

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I thought I was me, but we were wrong
email: geeflipr@internetcds.com

[TheAquaman]

a better method if your just treating a FO tank without any LR would be hyposalinity, If your using a Q tank then that would be even better to control, I've found that stress and improper diet will allow ick to over come the natural defenses fish have.

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You may be capable of great things,
But life consists of small things.

[billsreef]

I find garlic works for minor cases of ich but not for sever cases. To be sure of curing Ich any treatment must run 4 weeks to be sure of eradicating any that have encysted. The hyposalinity method mentioned by Aquaman is IMO the best method to cure ich.

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Bill
If damsels grew as big as sharks, the sharks would run in fear!
My Dive Photo's

www.billsreef.com

Anyone have any thoughts regarding UV on a Q tank? I no they are looked on as unneeded in general reef keeping but it seems this is one area they might have some use, What do you think?

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I thought I was me, but we were wrong
email: geeflipr@internetcds.com

[horge]

Hi Knute,
Danish extraction by any chance?

Anyways, yes hyposalinity can work vs. Cryptocaryon irritans, but keep in mind Moe reports that the dislodged cysts can remain viable for quite some time in the hyposaline solution --they are to be disposed of securely and under no circumstances reintroduced to saline solution. Infrequently, some of the beasties can be sufficiently protected by skin or gill mucus to survive hypo.

Feeding garlic also works, but only in terms of encouraging the ejection of cysts and individual parasites from the afflicted fish. Those banished remain viable.

In the end, the sure cure is starvation of the parasites.

Deprived of a fish host, the free swimming stage of the ciliate devils will die in a couple of weeks. If you take into account any lurking 'hibernating' cysts and cycle-overlap, some propose a hostless period of 72 days (!!) to be utterly sure.

So, you remove all fish from the display and treat them with hypo and/or garlic, disposing of any/all ejected cysts on the QTank bottom. After 2 weeks (or up to 72 days, haha) the display is free of Cryp/ich, and you can tell if the fish are likewise parasite-free and clear for reintroduction to the display.

Copper runs the risk of accelerating any breakout of Vibrio anguillarium in a heavily-loaded volume of water (like most QTanks) --again based on observations reported by Moe.

UV treats water, not fish. Besides, we all know from the ability of plankton to escape powerhead suction that you cannot ensure full treatment of the entire volume.

Just my peso
(equal to 2 US cents right now)
http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/smile.gif

[horge]

Whoops! Missed one of your queries, Knute!

Regarding how to use garlic...
I feed bits of raw garlic to the fish, and --particularly if it's a tang-- the stuff is relished.

You can also dose a water-soluble form of garlic extract, but it's hard to recommend dosage --I've heard two people report success at one drop per ten USgallons, every two days. QTank, of course.

Good luck!
http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/smile.gif

[Boom Boom]

According to the company that makes Kick Ich they say that garlic will help raise the fishes immune system and will help the fish fight off the parasite. But, the only drawback is that it doesnt kill the parasite in the tank and it may come back even stronger.

After the initial treatment boosting the fish populations immunity with Selcon is a good idea but untill you reduce the stressors in the tank,i.e. overcrowding this will be an uphill battle http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/frown.gif
FWIW, I have 3 gramma sized fish in a 55 and have never had to deal with ich, even after a disasterous tank crash,HTH

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I thought I was me, but we were wrong
email: geeflipr@internetcds.com

[KNUTE]

Thanks for all the info, Norske not Danske. At least I'm not a Swede. LOL. Have read most if not all of the major reef books by now as well as a majority of posts on several boards, lot of info out there. Garlic seems to work well. After keeping the copper level in the Q tank at 1.5 - 2 for a week and the apparent ick gone I switched to water based garlic extract and just soaked the food in it for an hour or so. One of the clowns started to show signs of the parasite as well but as the Tang was beginning to show signs of stress in the q tank I put him back in the 65 and fed all the fish the food soaked in garlic. I also was probally underfeeding so I increased feeding and now all is well. I will probally cont. to feed with garlic prophalacticaly for a while.I own a sailboat so can get all of the water I need from the ocean and I just keep it aerated and use it for water changes. From a lot of the reading it does seem that I have a heavy fish load but everyone gets along well and water quality is great. Haven't had any problems with the 2 anemones, they have stayed put. The corals seem to be doing fine, added a Open Brain and a Gorgonian a week ago. Have 75+ lbs. of live rock and 50 lbs of live sand and lots of Coraline algae growing allover the place. Thanks for all of the Ick info. A lot of people report using kalk 24/7 and I just use it at night, about 16 0z. dripped with an IV setup. I have read about 50/50 people using it just at night for replacement and 24/7. Any advantages of 24/7? PH is 8.2-8.4, Alk 3.5, Ca 400-420.