Reef safe starfish

[reefcam]

Looking for more critters to put in the tank and finally my wife wants to get different types of star fish. I know only the Chocolate Chips are not good in reef tank. I have a green serpant and want to know other than the sand stars, what other stars, that looks good, are reef safe? Or are the others safe as well. I'm thinking of the following:

Australian Biscuit Star
Black Banded Serpent Star
Blue Linckia or even the purple ones
General Stars
Marble Star
Orange Knobby Starfish

And are any incompatible to each other?

Thanks
jim

[horge]

I just love these common epithets.
Can I try to sort them out? http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/smile.gif

The ones on your list that stand out as unsafe are all the Protoreasterids: those 'knobbies' and 'generals' (--where the heck do they get these names? http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/eek.gif http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/biggrin.gif). Exceptions remain, but they are as a group aggressive predators and will chow on molluscs, other asteroids, even corals.

Linckias are far less obnoxious, they generally feed off of algal-bacterial films.

I had a lovely time trying to decipher 'marble star' until a friend said it was Fromia sp. If she's right, then it too is reef safe to a point: it will appreciate small morsels of marine protein, so don't expect it to pass up small molluscs and similar items in your rock.

The serpent star (sp.?) and the biscuit (Pentagonaster sp.?) are both scavengers, with the latter apparently more an herbivore than the others.

BTW, here's three things to keep in mind about asteroids in (very) general:

1)they can suffer severely from sudden changes in temperature and specific gravity of the surrounding solution. You have to acclimate them slowly, dripping your tank water into the transport bag very gradually (some people take up to 12 hours doing this).
Acclimatization is crucial for Fromia sp, and Pentagonaster sp., and less so for the Ophidian 'serpents' or 'brittles'. Take the time, or you could wind up with a small heap of brown glop on your hands.

2)They are all generally omnivorous pigs. They feed on larger morsels by sending out the stomach to digest the target item. Easy pickings for thieving fish! Linckias and brittles really don't need to be fed, unless your rocks are spotless.

3)They are never around when you want to see them. They will go where they please. Live with it. http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/smile.gif HTH

[This message has been edited by horge (edited 08-07-2000).]

[BA]

Jim--

Blue Linckias are completely reef safe and hardy. They will not need to be fed. Although I will probably be drummed out of the reef tank club or reported to the ASPCA I don't think they need the elaborate acclimatization that has been recommended. I've always just treat them as if they were new fish--float 'em, pour in some of the tank water after awhile, then let 'em go.

Best,
BA

[JennM]

BA--

Not "drumming you out" but trust me, they DO need careful acclimation (Blue Linckias, that is). I had one disintigrate on me after I painstakingly acclimated it to my tank, just last week.

I use a slow drip method, and took a couple of hours (perhaps I should have taken longer) to attempt to acclimate the one I bought online. Sadly, it perished.

*IF* I choose to try this species again, I will pick one from the LFS, because I can get it home fast enough to avoid the drastic changes in PH that ones that are transshipped experience (well, the LFS will have already dealt with that). I discussed what happened at length with the owner of the LFS where I shop, and he suggested (and this agrees with the other reading I did) that it died of PH shock, despite my best efforts to avoid this.

I've read where people have taken up to 9 hours do acclimate (but that person said they may have gone too long) but most did it within 2-3 hours. In my case, 2 hours was not enough.

I hope this info helps.

Jenn

[BA]

Jenn--

I have to stick by my guns--sounds like you bought yours thru the mail(?) and maybe it perished because of shipping trauma. I've always bought mine at the local very good LFS and have acclimated them as I mentioned and never had a problem. The critters, far from disintigrating, seem vigorous right away.
This is not to say that a more lengthy process is BAD, though.

Best,
BA

[reefcam]

Thanks for all the advice. I'll just keep an eye on my LFS to see what stars they have. Got me sold on not buying a star from MO. I have had my green serpant for about a year and he looks very healthy. I did buy him from the LFS.

Thanks.

[JennM]

BA-

Point respecfully taken http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/smile.gif and more power to you for having success with your Blue Linckia. I do think however, it's important that when attempting to acclimate a new one, that to err on the side of caution. You are right that mine via MO was much more vulnerable than yours purchased at LFS where the PH of their water was probably very close to your own.

I think both our experiences lent good advice to Reefcam!

Thanks for a pleasant exchange.

Jenn

[dragon0121]

Not to turn this into a blue linkia thread, but here is an AWESOME thread on blue linkia's, and includes a Kick @ss post from Biogeek. Like there is any other kind!
http://www.reefcentral.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/006718.html

Care must be taken in acclimating and providing an environment that will provide enough food http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/biggrin.gif .

[reefcam]

Sorry to hear about the stony mishap http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/frown.gif Smitty91.

Okay... no more stars... the wife doesn't like the serpant or brittle, but the LFS does have a red serpant...hmmmm

[horge]

Smitty, Protoreaster nodosus or the "chocolate chip star" (ugh), is one bad mother. If you want to you can, hehe, introduce it to some Hymenoceros sp. "Harlequin" shrimp. You can watch the choco chip get consumed little by little http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/biggrin.gif MWahahahahaha!!!!!

Regarding the fragility of Linckia spp....I'm quite ready to believe anyone who just plops them in and has success. I've done it in my time as well, but a lot depends (as has been intimated) on the relative health of the specimen AND moreso on the parametric differences between the different sets of tankwater. It's easy to roll the dice when you have a reef nearby to collect from. Tougher when you bet hard cash. I think it's always best to err on the safe side http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/smile.gif

A lot of the things you overseas folk find delicate I nearly regard as fecund weeds. Part of the problem is transport and holding; part of it is collection method; part of it is how young and small the specimen is (they withstand severe exposure better); and a big part is the skill and luck of the hobbyist. You as a hobbyist only have direct control over the last one, so why go cheap (time and effort-wise) on it? http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/smile.gif

[This message has been edited by horge (edited 08-07-2000).]

[Doug1]

I like green brittle stars, they are very entertaining but need feeding, I lost mine in tank crash and got a red brittle not nearly as extroverted as the green.


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Reef as if your life depended on it, yours might but the sea's does
Doug moderator TheReefTank

[Smitty91]

The green brittle is definately an impressive starfish. Moves much faster than I had ever imagined!!

I recently visited Memnock from another BB and he showed just how fast these stars can move. http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/eek.gif Almost seemed to move in the same fashion that an octopus does!!

The only hardy starfish that I know of is the chocolate chip, but I can vouch these guys aren't reef safe!! (unfortunately http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/frown.gif) I had a stoney that I was going to get a pic of to try and get an id on. I fed this stoney twice a week which was rather unique to watch. Then, the chocolate chip was slumped over it one day upon my returning home from work. No more stoney, just the skeleton http://www.thereeftank.com/ubb/frown.gif

Smitty

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Reefin in the US-of-A!
Livermore, CA

See 2 of my skimmerless
40gallon tank pics @

FISH WHISPERER'S LAGOON

Email: ms93@home.com

[Ermin]

Perhaps the linkia was on its way out when you brought it home. Their metabolism is so slow that it may take a week before showing the signs. ie. internal organs busted already due to too quick in acclimation by the LFS, then two days later, you buy it and it seems like "you" killed it.

[peiji]

I'm interested in the starfish discussion. I was thinking of getting one myself. I've got a fish only tank. For now, no live rock. Is it possible to keep starfish this way and if so, what kind. What do they eat?

[Doug1]

Peiji IME the large brittle satrs will be OK in FO tank as they are scavengers who will eat fish if not fed a tibit frequently. Most of the others eat algaes or corals, but I think a choclate chip star would do OK in FO also. I don't have a CC so you might want a second opinion

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Reef as if your life depended on it, yours might but the sea's does
Doug moderator TheReefTank